Chuck vs. the Shippers

How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Angst

Embrace the Angst

I apologize for every nasty thing I ever said about Chuck, the producers of Chuck, the writers of Chuck or anyone in Hollywood associated with Chuck.  It’s not you, it’s me.  I wasn’t paying attention, I was taking you for granted, I see that now, and I’m so sorry.  I know we can work it out, you just need to give me some time, and we need to work on our communication skills.  We can make this work, I know we can, but we really need to talk.

…OK, I’ll go first.  After the jump.

We Really Made a Mess of Things, Didn’t We.

All those months apart, longing for you to come back, not understanding how you could be so callous, first missing you, then resenting you, and finally wondering if we were fooling ourselves.  Did we ever really have something together?  Was it all just a big misunderstanding?  Had we given you too much credit, misjudged your feelings?  Then you were back in our lives, and all those familiar feelings came flooding back.  Yes, it was real, now we remember.  At last we have a chance to work things out, together.  If we learn from this we can move forward and build something far more mature, real, and lasting.  But we have to clear up some of those misunderstandings first.

OK, so I’m laying it on a little thick.  But a curious thing happened the other day.  I had a longer than normal commute due to some serious backups on the DC Metro area roads, so after a while I got tired of the radio and slipped in my Chuck Music CD.  I started to think about this blog and some of the comments on my most recent post and to plan my next one…It’s a hobby, OK, I can quit any time I want, really.  One that I was thinking about was someone had said something about Sarah not getting on the train.  I kind of scoffed.  Of course she got on the train, Chuck just dumped her, what is Sarah Walker going to do, beg?  She’s not Chuck, constantly wanting to talk more and more.  Man Chuck was annoying in three words, that was going to be a tough one to explain too.  Chuck knows better than to interrupt a mission with his feelings, or at least he should by now, and making him go on and on like that, you just want the dude to man up a bit, or shut up.  Of Course Carina didn’t help, telling Chuck Sarah still loved him.  He inexplicably pissed that away, so why is it so critical now that he talk to her, but he couldn’t say more than “I’m sorry, I can’t” on the platform with the woman he loved and who loves him wanting to run away together forever?  Now he gets himself trapped in a vault and while Sarah is trying to save him he’s emoting all over the place like he…  Wait a minute…  Chuck didn’t know Sarah was in love with him.  How would he?

And that my friends was the beginning of the Epiphany post.  I realized in the car on the way to work, listening to Frightened Rabbit’s Backwards Walk, that I was so busy looking for what I thought should happen and getting angry at what I felt shouldn’t that I’d forgot one important thing, I wasn’t telling the story.  And as episode 3 reminded me, the producers, writers, and actors of Chuck were damn good at telling an entertaining story, when I wasn’t preventing them with pre-conceived ideas.  I spent a slightly distracted day at work, constantly re-running Chuck episodes and scenes in my head, convinced that I really did remember things right, but had been so wrapped up what I thought I should be seeing that I missed the significance of what I did see.  And there was my answer.  It was on the screen.  They did tell me why Chuck couldn’t speak, and why he could dump Sarah to be a spy, and of course Sarah got on the train, and Chuck thought she was leaving forever.  And it also told me why they ran two episodes back to back.  Vital questions in episode 1 weren’t answered until episode 2, and if we’ve seen anything in the last few months it’s that unanswered questions can’t go unanswered for too long.  We’ll find our own answers, good or bad, but we’ll find our answers whether TPTB provide them or not.  Once our answers are lodged in our heads the writers are going to have a tough time replacing ours with theirs.

So here it is, lessons learned, hopefully on both sides, of what we owe the artists, and what they owe us.  For brevity sake limited to Chuck.

OK, I’ll Let You Go First.

I’ll admit it.  Based on spoilers, leaks, promos, previews, discussions and all the rest I thought I had a pretty good idea of what to expect.  I don’t think I realized just how much I’d “written” in my head.  Too much probably.  It is a lot of fun to look for the clues and speculate (like when Morgan wishes for a flying DeLorean at the end of Gravitron and then we get, Chuck vs. the DeLorean).  And be honest, you, yes you TPTB have invited us to do this.  There are too many scenes where we see Chuck tossing another passport in a shoebox, or walking into his bedroom in a rappelling harness and body armor as if it’s just another day in the life for us to not try to fill in the blanks, where we see blanks.  I’ll give it a few weeks and keep in mind that you might be aware and wanting to fill in the blanks.  It’s a big payoff when we see one of those, so it’s worth the wait.

I’ll Learn to Trust You More.

So I’m supposed to believe nothing happened at the rehearsal dinner?  Nothing?  Are you kidding me?  Am I supposed to swallow that Chuck still is uncertain about Sarah’s feelings for him?  Oh, I am?  … OK.  You’re pushing the limits sometimes, but I’ll make this promise.  I’ll show a little more trust.  If you tell me all the really important stuff is on the screen, if I’m willing to look, I’ll believe you.  Just don’t abuse that trust.

I Won’t Take You For Granted (but we already knew that).

I promise I am going to watch every episode of Chuck with a Subway footlong.  I’m going to buy season 3 on iTunes and DVD.  I’m going to talk you up every chance I get, to friends and family and co-workers; maybe even to random strangers on the Metro if they start looking over my shoulder while I’m watching Chuck on my iPhone.  Because we almost lost you, and we want you to be a part of our lives for as long as you can.  But then you already know you have the best fans in the world.

Don’t Take Us for Granted.

But then you don’t.  When I look at twitter and see the things the cast does for the fans, I’m guessing you already know that.  The cast and crew of Chuck are some special people.  Don’t ever lose that, you’ll have fans for life.  It’s just that sometimes you seem to be more interested in no spoilers, or not thinking about tying up story-lines at the end of a season, just in case, god forbid, you don’t get another.  You owe us a story.  Beginning, middle, end.  Adam Baldwin knows that.  Serenity showed just how powerful that connection between you and your fans can be.

If the Journey is the Point, Don’t Go In Circles.

I think you get this one.  Bryce was getting old the second time he came back to break up Chuck and Sarah.  When I saw him in the Ring all I could see was Fonzie wearing a leather jacket and water skis.  You managed to dodge that one, but really, come on.  And the whole Chuck is unsure of Sarah’s feelings and so looks for something real?  Uhm, OK, you really seem to have Fonzie speeding toward the ramp with Hannah.  Please tell me you have something more.  Please?

In Conclusion

I’ve said this before, but it seems to be appropriate.  Chuck is not the best comedy, the best drama, or spy series or action drama or love story on TV.  But Chuck has all those elements, and a group of immensely talented writers and a wonderfully talented cast with indescribable chemistry who can take those elements and add something more.  The connection, the feeling that this is real, though we know it isn’t, and the feeling that this is important, and these people care, and this matters.  It makes me care, and it makes it matter.  It makes it the best damn show on TV.

Acknowledgements

I want to thank both Joe and ATCDave for helping me get my head around this topic with some background and great encouragement and suggestions.  I also want to thank Rick Holy for an awesome comment on over analyzing that helped me find a new direction for a floundering, overly long post.

Lastly I want to apologize for my butchering of the english language through constant mixing of the singular and plural, but it’s late and I want to move on.

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About Ernie Davis

I was born in 1998, the illegitimate brain child and pen name of a surly and reclusive misanthrope with a penchant for anonymity. My offline alter ego is a convicted bibliophile and causes rampant pognophobia whenever he goes out in public. He wants to be James Lileks when he grows up or Dave Barry if he doesn’t.  His hobbies are mopery, curling and watching and writing about Chuck.  Obsessively.  Really, the dude needs serious help.
This entry was posted in Angst, Observations, Season 3. Bookmark the permalink.

27 Responses to Chuck vs. the Shippers

  1. Rick Holy says:

    A magnum opus, my chuck-luvin’ friend! Especially your straight to the point and straight from the heart (and head) statement:

    “I’ve said this before, but it seems to be appropriate. Chuck is not the best comedy, the best drama, or spy series or action drama or love story on TV. But Chuck has all those elements, and a group of immensely talented writers and a wonderfully talented cast with indescribable chemistry who can take those elements and add something more. The connection, the feeling that this is real, though we know it isn’t, and the feeling that this is important, and these people care, and this matters. It make me care, and it makes it matter. It makes it the best damn show on TV.”

    Don’t know how it could have been said any better!!

    Peace! & good night all.

  2. ChuckNewbie8 says:

    There’s a certain amount of the journey vs. destination going on when it comes to Chuck and the ship.

    Sure we all wishes the journey not be as jumpy as it could be, but I think we all realize that no matter how aggravating, we still tune in because they keep us tuned in. They give us just enough shipper kool-aid to get us interested and just enough to frustrate. The idea of Shaw, Hannah, et al…worries me but personally I’m the kind of person that thinks everything will be all right and things are never as bad until you experience it. That’s how I deal with it lol.

    But perhaps best of all, what gets me through the day is having you guys, and other “shippers” like me who agonize, discuss and vent together. We may not always agree but we all find ways to help each other out in this Chuck maze lol.

  3. OldDarth says:

    Not all angst is bad.

  4. NoWayOut says:

    I no longer trust TPTB as far as I could throw Casey. Which is sad, because the writers are brilliant and the actors are superb. If they were allowed to put their talents to crafting a show that didn’t play this stupid WT/WT game, Chuck would rate near the top of shows all time.

    And more to the point, I think, TPTB have lost control of the “relationship.” They are NOT seeing what the screen is showing us. Regardless of how well they craft things and how logically they can sell more angst, the screen is showing us something different because of the chemistry between Levi and Strahovski.

    Schwartz killed The OC because he let what he thought was his writing skills override what the screen was showing. Showrunners who think they can override the pictures lose in the end.

    Chuck is at risk for this reason. Not because Chuck and Sarah ever needed or had to be together from a show-structure sense. But because two actors found a professional groove that simply burns up the screen.

    Schwartz should have learned his lesson with The OC. He should have seen from the dailies of Versus the Colonel that he chemistry on-screen demanded Chuck and Sarah be put together, regardless of what he had wanted to write. I’m not talking as a shipper–I’m not–but as a viewer who comes to the screen each week and see what is going on. The pictures tell me what to think.

    Schwartz has ignored the truth on the screen. This tortured and so far cynical season shows exactly what happens when a writer tries to outwrite the pictures.

    Can’t be done. TV is, if nothing else, a visual medium. If Chuck goes down this year it is because viewers (not us fans) don’t find it true because the writing does not match the pictures. And then the casual viewer drifts away without even knowing why.

    That’s the power of a visual medium–and the risk.

    My guess (sadly) is that the casual viewer will be gone before Schwartz finally bows to the obvious and puts the Chuck and Sarah characters together. Even with NBC in the straits it is in, so many viewers will have departed that it won’t be retrievable.

    That, in fact, is what happened to The OC after a brilliant second season…

  5. atcdave says:

    I’m sure it won’t shock anyone that I agree strongly the “s-angst” has been way overdone. Making Chuck and Sarah into flaky parodies who have no clue what they want in life, and can’t figure out how to make things work together; is the most depressing and damaging choice the writers can possibly make. As many have observed, the greatest strength of the show is the dynamic between them; great screen chemistry, likable characters, and an unlikely romance. When it works, its about the most compelling thing I’ve ever seen on television.
    But the WT/WT is way past its shelf life. I think the writers (or at least JS) believe they have one more round-about left. At least, that’s my operating assumption. I expect to absolutely hate some of what’s coming with Shaw and Hannah. But I think, when its over this time, its over. I don’t mean life will ever be easy for our favorite twosome, but I think the WT/WT aspect will be over.
    For most viewers, this may be a great story arc that finally resolves an annoying sub-plot. Those of us who have been emotionally invested in the show for a while, feel more frustration than casual viewers do. But I think the writers make a huge mistake when they think more casual viewers actually like this sort of story telling. Every viewer I know, no matter how committed or casual, rolls their eyes at every mention of a triangle. It isn’t good storytelling, its painfully tired cliche to lifelong TV viewers.
    But I do believe its coming to an end. We’ve heard many comments to that effect. From Yvonne’s “this season they go from like to love” to JS saying “the romantic sub-plot will be resolved.”
    I even have some hope (not much mind you, but some) that the coming Shaw arc won’t be as angst-filled as we’ve been led to believe. Mainly from Yvonne’s recent comments about episodes 6-10 being what Chuck fans really want to see; its possible she’s clueless, or just repeating the party line; but the comment seemed clear and unambiguous to me. We may all be pleasantly surprised.

    • Rick Holy says:

      I’m with you brother! That’s why I keep “hanging in there!” If we are blessed with a Season 4, I think/hope that the WT/WT will be resolved – actually it MAY (hopefully) even be resolved by the end of the “front 13” of this season. The creators/writers did say that they were going to keep to their original story line for the 13 episodes – and that the “back 6” would become like a Season 3.2 (with Scott Bakula returning, it should be GREAT!).

      For now it can be annoying/frustrating/maddening, etc., but I just keep hanging in there!!

    • herder says:

      My best guess is that the big angsty episodes will be 3.06 & 3.07 the love trapezoid comment, if Hannah is gone after 3.07 then the trapezoid is gone. I also think there will be a continuation and resolution of sorts in 3.08. Then again I could be wrong.

      Of course it is overdone by now, in fact I find that it sucks the fun out of other parts of the show. Why TPTB think this is the way to go is beyond me, but apparantly they do.

      As far as it being much less angsty than we have been led to beleive, I think that you may be correct. I think back to what Robert Duncan Mcneil said in an interview this past summer/fall that rather than being a love triangles it was more of “3D chess”. I always took it to mean that while there may be some personal feelings involved between the parties that the motivating force is more likely some as yet undisclosed ulterior motive. That is why I have leaned towards Hannah being a spy or a mark and Shaw persuing Sarah for it’s effect on Chuck. Doesn’t mean that Chuck and Sarah don’t feel anything for Hannah and Shaw or vice versa, but rather they are shallow feelings that ordinarily would not be acted upon and in the end don’t go very far.

  6. weaselone says:

    Ernie, you had me at the Dr. Strangelove reference.

    Given my promise to alternate between posting about the relationship and other Chuck topics, I’m going to attempt the impossible and respond to a thread devoted to angst without making it all about the relationship.

    First, I’ll state that I’m in agreement with OldDarth when he notes that not all angst is bad. It isn’t, not even when it pertains to the relationship that shall not be named. At times angst can be quite entertaining, or dare I say it even humorous for all its discomfort. The angst is harmful when it’s so obviously contrived that if they squint the fans see Josh Schwartz in the background tugging on the marionette strings, or if it damages the key characters.

    The first example is probably a good reason for any future fan or network to avoid Josh Schwartz like a plague should he ever pitch another TV show. Schwartz has shown a remarkable tendency to bend his shows to his will in opposition to the more organic direction that develops as an initial concept is brought to life through the interaction of writers, directors, staff and actors. Whether through skill, or by accident, Schwartz can obtain all the items necessary for a great show. He finds a great concept, hires capable staff, great writers, and fantastic, relatively unknown actors who together manage to create a show and characters that click and feel real no matter how outlandish the concept. Then somewhere along the way the show’s own momentum causes it to drift from the course he’d plotted and he forces back on track no matter how many ice bergs he has to ram to get there. Short term viewers just assume this was the path all along, and longer term viewers overlook these faults and just enjoy the other aspects of the show.

    Chuck has many pleasant aspects including comedy, romance, action, drama, geeky pop culture references, great music, cool spy stuff, Jeffster, and attractive cast members willing to expose skin on a regular basis. As many have noted Chuck is basically the jack of all trades master of none of TV shows. I would argue that it excels on one point, the creation of characters that the audience finds compelling and likeable. For all Chuck’s flaws, inadequacies and flashes of mediocrity, it’s the characters that keep us coming back to see Jeffster’s latest antics, Big Mike’s battles with boxes of donuts, Casey’s one liners and the tug of war between Chuck and Sarah. Destroy the characters and you destroy the appeal of the show.

    The writers seem to excel at providing ever more nuance to the supporting cast and Casey and up until this point they’ve done well developing the individual characters of Chuck and Sarah. Now, they seem to be on the brink of ruining the two characters by converting them into parodies of themselves. Chuck’s chased after enough brunettes and Sarah has ogled enough underwear models turned spies. It’s enough. If they both are really that shallow, they’re no longer going to be compelling characters worth watching, and as good as Baldwin is at playing the Grizzly bear with a heart of sugar, as much twisted fun as Jeffster brings and as much general awesomeness we get in the form of Devon Woodcomb, it’s not enough if the show’s central characters are as likable and nuanced as their cardboard cutouts standing next to season 2 DVD displays.

    So there it is. My angst really has nothing to do with the relationship between Chuck and Sarah. It’s the fear they’ll damage one or both characters while they engage in their little dance.

    • Ernie Davis says:

      Weaselone, you have captured my feelings on this matter exactly. It is not the angst per se, but the lengths they go to to create it, seemingly for it’s own sake. I am presently working on what threatens to be another stemwinder. I will be very interested in what you think once I post. Hopefully tonight or tomorrow. But as a tease I’ll give you this.

      “I saw these as repetitive and unimaginative for a show that could and did do so much better on everything but the romance. And it was hurting the show. The constant Angst hung over everything, weighing down the otherwise snappy pace and lighthearted fun of the show. And now I’ve learned after the first three, that I was right.”

    • NoWayOut says:

      Weaselone-
      Brillianly posited.

      And we know EXACTLY when this show’s two primary characters went off the track: After the end of Versus the Colonel. As Ernie Davis pointed out recently, and Liz James first posted at this blog months ago, SOMETHING would have happened during and after the rehersal dinner. At a minimum, Chuck and Sarah’s characters would have finally talked directly. At maximum, the characters would have made love (or had sex, if you think they were still simply in the lust stage).

      That flaw has been impossible to cover up. And now that they are doing another season of damage to the characters, their previous writings and their previous situations, it might be irretrievable. As I’ve said, by the time Schwartz decides he can’t play the childish games anymore, there might not be enough viewers left.

      We’ll actually know more from the ratings after this week’s show. If they dip below, say, 7 million, you know the show will be in trouble by season’s end. If they stay where they were last week (about 7.3 million), you kick the can down the road for a few weeks to see what the love trapezoid (gak, what a bizarre distillation of Schwartz’s worst traits) does to the ratings.

      • weaselone says:

        I don’t think we can tell anything from the ratings for at least the next three weeks. At best we’ll see the flight of the hardcore shippers, but the chances are they left after seeing the Sunday premier. Episode 3.3 was far more palatable on the relationship front, and I’m assuming that 3.4 will be similar. I also think it’s safe to assume that neither Shaw nor Hannah will make significant progress in 3.5. We might see some general flirtatiousness, and perhaps even be treated statements or actions of loyalty by Chuck and Sarah.

        Episodes 3.6 and 3.7 will be the turning point. Anything between Chuck and Hannah will occur in these two episodes, and whatever happens between Sarah and Shaw will certainly in motion by this point. If viewers are turned off by these episodes, it will be reflected in the numbers for the following week. Unfortunately, Chuck breaks for the Olympics after number 7, so any drop in ratings will probably be spun as an effect of the hiatus by the show’s executive producers.

      • NoWayOut says:

        Weaselone-
        My point was that if we see a negative drift this week, for whatever reason, we know there’s trouble. If not, then we see where we are at the Olympics break and right after.

        But if Chuck can’t hold it’s audience this week, with a cliffhanger ending topping off a good, fun, accessible episode, we know we got trouble with a T.

  7. weaselone says:

    So I’ve just watched the Bo scene again (and again, and again…). It remains one of my favorite, if not my favorite scene in episode 3.2. It’s a powerful scene that utilizes the chemistry between Zach and Yvonne to great effect. Both actors are amazing in their roles, and Zach probably edges Yvonne in the number and nuance of the emotions he displays. You have two characters, both in love, both deeply hurting. One is pouring out her hurt in the form of rage, while the other meekly accepts it, trying desperately to gain the opportunity to speak words that might sooth them both.

    The scene is also one that leaves me with a less than appealing question. When does Chuck get to be angry with Sarah? They’re both responsible for the mess that was Prague, but it seems that Sarah’s the only one permitted to deliberately inflict further injury. In this scene, Chuck struggles with his own pain over his loss of Sarah, the pain and guilt he feels over the hurt he inflicted on Sarah, and he absorbs the anger and hurt Sarah directs at him during the fight. In the end he refuses to fight and Sarah sends him to the floor where it seems his hurt, Sarah’s hurt and her anger nearly overwhelm him.

    Does Chuck ever get to strike back and show Sarah exactly how much suffering she’s caused him, or will Chuck only demonstrate it by proxy with snide comments and punches thrown at Shaw?

    • NoWayOut says:

      Short answer: no. At least not until Chuck realizes that Sarah is no more in control of her emotions than he is.

      That is one of the few really interesting possibilities this season has opened. They have now established Sarah as an all-or-nothing girl. She goes for big emotional play the moment she gives into her feelings (hence the crazed kiss before the “bomb” in season 1 and the “let’s run away” thing now).

      When Chuck is strong enough to tell Sarah that HE isn’t the only one who has to work on controlling his emotions, they can move forward…

    • NoWayOut says:

      Long answer: No, because…
      1) In Chuck’s mind, he’s still reaching up to Sarah. You know, she’s “out of his league” and he’s always thrilled to even be in the game.

      2) Chuck still hasn’t figured out exactly how deep Sarah’s pain goes.

      3) He still knows nothing about her and he knows that.

      4) Lastly, he believes he was at fault in Prague and, because he’s the emotional one on the surface, he’s thought about it. He thinks he’s missed an opportunity and he believes that Sarah offered him what he wanted and he turned away, for whatever valid reasons.

      5) Chuck’s most endearing quality is that he’ll protect anyone close to him. Even those who have hurt him (Bryce, Jill).

  8. NoWayOut says:

    UH, MOMENT OF DISCOVERY HERE (I THINK…)
    Weaselone sent me back to the bo scene to watch it and what it is missing is pretty crucial. When Chuck stops fighting and Sarah asks him the “Why not?” question, he answers: “Because I don’t want to hurt you!” Whereupon she decks him and spits out her memorable line. But shouldn’t Chuck have answered Sarah’s “Why not?” with: “Because I LOVE YOU and I don’t want to hurt you!”

    Which led me to his thought: When did Chuck EVER tell Sarah “I Love You”? Until he tumbles out of the room with Karl’s briefcase, I do not believe he has EVER said those words to her face. Which may explain her shocked look as he tumbles out of the room. (Check that scene again…) I mean, I can’t screen all 38 episodes, but until Three Words, he never said “I Love You” to Sarah, I don’t think. I mean, I cannot remember when he did.

    Chuck has said zillions of things to Sarah–you’re the girl of my dreams; you’re everything I ever wanted; it feels real; his litany of superlatives in First Date–but NEVER the simple, absolutely critical and supremely necessary “I Love You!” declaration to Sarah.

    I throw this out there for no other reason than it is what it is. If we’re going to treat these two characters seriously, well, Chuck’s inability/unwillingness to say it before Three Words is absolutely shocking…

    • joe says:

      Good observation, NoWay. But I don’t think it’s shocking. Sarah has done everything she could for two seasons to dissuade him from saying those words. He’s had to go around them every time.

      I have to admit, that I did notice that (and really, some time ago, maybe I noticed that he DIDN’T say that in LW). But Chuck’s meaning was so clear it hardly seemed to matter. Sarah was in control of that.

      • weaselone says:

        Outside of when she asked Chuck to run, Sarah’s always been in control of the relationship, and she was back in control the moment she showed up in Prague. At that point Chuck either had to come with her, or lose her. She’s back in complete control now. What relationship they have is completely determined by her. Chuck once more has to break through the walls erected and win her back.

        The continuation of this power dynamic in the relationship is aggravating. I’d almost be willing to countenance a real relationship between Hannah and Chuck if it mean that Sarah became the pursuer for once.

      • NoWayOut says:

        Actually, Weaselone, I don’t know if it will be chuck breaking through walls again this time. I mean, even for this crew of powers that be, that’s almost too obvious. And since S3 is shaping up as a flip of S2, maybe Sarah does the pursuing this time.

        What I’ve been cogitating about is the disclosure of Sarah’s real name. Given that these guys never throw anything away, we can assume that the revelation of the name is important. (Cue ominous music…)

        Does it come on a marriage license (too obvious, not likely) or at a moment when Sarah has to convince Chuck that this time it’s real. (I guess Real 2.0, since we were told it was real in Colonel.)

        Perhaps it goes like this…
        We’ve seen the clip where Sarah kisses Shaw, then Chuck clocks Shaw. That’s episode 8, we’re told. So maybe, after Chuck clocks Shaw,he’s just disgusted and Sarah has to come after him. And the only way she can convince him of her sincerity is by giving up her real name… The name of Episode 8: CHuck versus the Fake Name. (On the other hand, the episode was originally called Chuck versus the Nose.)

        That’s the problem with this. Since TPTB have now proven that they’ll break characters and ignore what we know, it’s hard to find any logic anymore.

      • weaselone says:

        I’m not certain what to think at the moment. Shaw probably already knows Sarah’s real name. It’s implied that he knows everything else, so why not that piece of trivia. That removes any value it has as a demonstration of emotional intimacy between Shaw and Sarah.

        Chuck’s likely the recipient at a time Sarah feels he needs to hear it, or she is desperate that he hear it. Because Chuck is the Intersect, her real name would amount to more than just a single true and meaningful detail. He would probably flash on her entire history. She wouldn’t just be giving him one thing, she’d practically be giving him everything.

    • herder says:

      I finally rewatched the first three episodes tonight, if there ever was a time for either of these characters to say “I love you” it was during the the train station scene. If Sarah had said it Chuck likey would have gone with her if Chuck had said it then she might have understood why not.

      Of course that would not have served the the puroposes of the writers, but if you are losing the one you love, as both were I can’t imagine real characters failing to mention it.

      As to the name revelation, I can’t imagine it to be to someone other than Chuck as a method of convincing him that she still loves him. I have already posted that I think that 3.08 is where the Shaw/Sarah romance ends, this -I think- is part of her proof to Chuck that that is so. As to the nose part, look at the promo after the first two episodes, Paulie what’s his name has a big nose, that’s where the title originated but they changed it.

  9. angelTwo says:

    I am surprised that no one has caught this yet: In Chuck Versus the Ring, Beckman put Sarah in charge of Intersect 2.0 when it was Bryce getting downloaded. Why wouldn’t Sarah also be in charge of Intersect 2.0 now that Chuck, who trusts her, has it? Logic would dictate that Sarah would be more needed as the helm with Chuck getting the Intersect.

    So not only does neither say I Love You at the train station–ABSURD!–the train station scene should never have happened.

    As NoWayOut has said, this is cynical and manipulative writing at its worst.

  10. Zsjaer says:

    I got say this…the spoilers have ruined a lot the fun i was expecting to have for this Season..i am anticipating so much the angst that i m not enjoying the show as i should.
    I know i am a silly shipper but its true..the only moment that was special for me so far was the one with the bow training session..i m so stressed up with the 3 episodes with Shaw that i couldn t enjoy that final scene with sarah watching Chucks explantion in 3×02 or even the “friendly” hug in 3×03.
    I have to blame the writers for this….we hradcore fans didn t deserve that.
    Lol..i don t remember to hate so much a fictional character as i hate Shaw (and he didn t even sshow up)hum..maybe only the good old J.R. from Dallas heh

    • Zsjaer says:

      I mean 8 ep with Shaw

    • joe says:

      Spoilers and worrying about other’s reaction to clips will do that to you every time, Z. There’s no need to get stressed.

      Oh, the writers gave us silly hard-core ‘shippers plenty to enjoy in those first three episodes, especially in Angel de la Muerta. Love the end of The Three Words when they agree to clean up the mess (but Chuck’s on his own with the courtyard).

      As impatient as I am for C&S to be in a committed, stable relationship, I get the idea that 1 season of ‘shipper time is like 5 or 6 in a normal show. It’s because we think about it so much.

  11. Pingback: Going in Circles Gets You Nowhere « Chuck This

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