A True Spoiler

And I Don’t Think You’ll Like It!

Word’s out about 3.08, Chuck vs. The Fake Name, and to be quite honest, it’s got me worried. Here’s the link.

I’m worried because it seems to be exactly, precisely, conclusively, beyond a shadow of a doubt what many of my good friends here said that they don’t want to see happen. It’s exactly what many have said would drive them away. I don’t believe they were lying.

I’m the one who’s said that for good or for bad, what I appreciate is always feeling – something. And from what I’m reading, even I am going to be watching come Monday with doubt and trepidation (and how fitting that the Lenten Season has started). The last 10 minutes of The Mask were indeed a teaser for things to come.

I’ve seen the assurances that this is going to be worth the – let’s call it the emotional investment. Today, I’m not feeling sanguine about that. But then again, today, I’m not supposed to. Apparently, after the next episode we’re supposed to feel something akin to hopeless. The week until 3.09 starts to look like an abyss.

I’ve got no inside information or knowledge about any of this, so I’m taking it purely on faith that we’re being led to the brink to overlook the precipice for a reason. I can offer no assurances that haven’t been said before. This is going to be a leap of faith.

– joe

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About joe

In my life I've been a professor, martial artist, rock 'n roller, rocket scientist, lover, poet and brain surgeon. I'm lying about the brain surgery.
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266 Responses to A True Spoiler

  1. Mike B says:

    I don’t like to pre-judge before I see the episode but I have always found Magnus to be accurate with his assessments and for him to post this blog it has got to be pretty bad. Mo Ryan said that this episode was a direct dig at the fan base.

    I don’t understand how you can stick your tongue out at the same fans that fought for your renewal. It just doesn’t make good business sense.

    • joe says:

      I heard Mo Ryan’s interview, and saw what she wrote, but I don’t recall that she said it was a direct dig, Mike.

      You have me curious – can you provide a link?
      Thanks.

      • Mike B says:

        I believe it was on the Chuck me Tuesday podcast. I will go back and double check.

      • Mike B says:

        I apologize it was a quote from Jace, who wrote the following about ep 8:

        “With a wink and a nod, Adler gives the characters license to poke fun at our own expectations and hang-ups about on-screen romances with a nicely played self-referential zing”.

      • joe says:

        I see! Thanks for tracking this down, Mike.

        There’s a sense in which I agree with Jace. When I re-watch S3 episodes I see a huge amount of self-referential material, some of which is rather subtle. Ex: Chuck cautioning Devon to not speculate. “9 times out of 10, it amounts to nothing. Well, 7.”. A wink and a nod (and a zing), indeed.

        Gee. I guess we’re into the 3 out of ten part of that set.

    • BigCheese says:

      Now I’m sure, 308 will be WORSE than 307.

      Nonsense.

      Don’t have faith in 309 anymore too.

      JS/CF/PK/AA shipper terminators!

  2. JLR says:

    Just posted in another thread, but DR was uncharacteristically sympathetic towards shippers… Makes me morbidly curious what happens to upset even non-shippers (like me). I’m already a bit peeved at the lead characters …. Gonna pop some popcorn Mon night after playing basketball, and watch the boards explode. Then I’ll watch the episode late that night. Sounds like the board reactions will be more entertaining than the actual episode.

    • joe says:

      Yeah. I fear it will be.

      • John says:

        Telling comment from Magnus.

        “Yeah, the forum fans are very hardcore. And this blog is more for them. The people who don’t go to forums and don’t live and breath these characters will probably not be bothered by it… much.”

      • SWnerd says:

        Considering Chuck fans caused an Internet explosion over 10 minutes of OOC, we may actually bring it down completely with an entire episode of “disgusting” OOC. Should be interesting.

      • Faith says:

        I’m wondering what kind of damage control JS and CF and TPTB will channel after Chuckapocalypse 2.0. Insulting the fan base is not and will not be the way to go.

      • John says:

        JS and CF will give an interview with Sepinwall, answer fluffy questions, and then tell the fans it is up to them to save the show.

      • Zsjaer says:

        Oh..well i m not going to watch this episode without consulting the forums and the Blog first. My wife already didn t watched ep 7 and probably she and i will do the same with this one.

      • atcdave says:

        I think I will; but I honestly, I don’t know if my wife will join me or not. Due to the Olympics, we’re kind of behind on some things; maybe we’ll watch a couple episodes of Psych after supper, and I’ll save Chuck for after she’s gone to bed.

  3. JC says:

    “Insanely offensive to the established Sarah character”

    What could be that bad?
    Sleeps with Shaw.
    Betrays Chuck.
    Has been working with Shaw.
    Says Chuck was nothing but a mark.

    I’m trying to think of other things it could be.

    • joe says:

      Is a Ring agent (but honestly, that’s far less offensive to your 1st or 2nd choice).

      • JC says:

        Its been my theory for awhile that she’s been working with Shaw. They’ve been playing Chuck since the conversation about Shaw’s wife. And somehow Chuck finds out.

        This kinda reinforces my belief.

      • OldDarth says:

        Nothing so elaborate I am afraid. What you have seen is what you are going to get. Which is part of the reason for the upcoming 3.08 OOC mess.

    • kg says:

      I’ll still watch. How can you not? I was so anticipating this episode. I must admit, I’m a little trepid.

      JC and Joe, any and all of the ones you mentioned would suck. Big Time. I’m going to feel crappy. I do right now.

      But I still appreciate Magnus alerting us. It will probably hurt, annoy, frustrate and offend me watching it unfold. But because of the warning, I’m hoping it won’t shock me.

      I love Yvonne Strahovski. I love Sarah Walker. I can’t get enough of either one. I hope she doesn’t disappoint. I hope she doesn’t break my heart. I’ve had enough of that in real life.

      • joe says:

        Well, I’m going to watch. I’m going to await 3.09 eagerly, especially considering the reviews I’ve read.

        My worry is for those who’ve already said they aren’t going to do that.

        Honestly, I’m oscillating wildly between feeling gentle empathy and wanting to collar them and shout “Hey! Snap out of it! It’s just a TV show! It’ll work out!!!” Neither is quite appropriate right now.

        What’s appropriate is venting. I think.

      • atcdave says:

        I will watch the rest of the season; but as you said, “its just a TV show.” Its not a lifelong commitment, for many casual fans, when it ceases to entertain, its time to move on. Sounds like that may be this Monday.

  4. Jason says:

    wow – I just read some more of the ‘blog’ in question, the blogger is on line and answering all ?’s, he is not pulling any punches, and I don’t even think he is a shipper – geez

  5. SWnerd says:

    Wow, ruining my all time favorite television character…thanks JS & CF. You guys are the bestest showrunners in the history of showrunning.

    My three guesses for this event:
    -She sleeps with Shaw
    -She tells Shaw her real name
    -Or this is the “do you love me” episode and her answer is awful

    I do find it interesting that Ali Adler is writing the most painful shipper episode ever. She must have fallen off the Charah wagon.

  6. herder says:

    I’ve been thinking with greater certainty over the past few weeks that Sarah does in fact “move on” with Shaw. In one of her interviews she says that it is hard seeing someone move on and in another she says something like seeing someone else move on can help push you to move on too. I think this is exactly what happens.

    From what they are saying it sounds like she lays it out to Chuck that while she did love him in the past that because of his actions in Prague and his relationship with Hannah that is over and she will try to be happy with Shaw. It sucks and is contrary to the character we have known, but that is my guess.

    What I don’t get is why JS – and I’m laying all this at his feet – would think that this is good storytelling and something that would be something that the fans would accept. I can see a major break in trust between fans and the people who put this show together coming.

  7. JC says:

    Well I can’t say I’m shocked after reading what OD said about my theory. Schwartz made Marissa on the OC completely unlikable during the third season.

    • SWnerd says:

      True. And then he killed her. Hm…

    • herder says:

      It has been said by others but I will repeat it as my own, I will never watch another Josh Scwartz(sp) show again. I will watch Chuck to the bitter end but sorry Kristin, if your new pilot with Josh is picked up I won’t watch it.

      • SWnerd says:

        I actually found it amusing that he’s doing a sitcom. I mean he does understand that you can’t pull this kind of melodramatic crap in that genre right? If anything, Chuck has proved that he’s not ready to take that step outside the teen angst.

      • JLR says:

        I’ve said the same…here & on other forums. No more JS projects for me…ever. He can tell his stories; he doesn’t seem to respect fans as much as we the fans are told we must respect TPTB.

      • kg says:

        Yeah Herder

        After Chuck, I’m done with this guy. He’s dead to me.

        I never watched the OC, but from what I’ve read from many of you he buried that show. What a shame.

        I haven’t watched TV shows consistently for several years now. I’m basically sports and Bill O’Reilly.

        I stumbled upon CHUCK after switching from a shitty Monday Night Football game couple of years ago.

        What can I say? I was heartwarmed.

  8. Fake Empire says:

    Oh boy . . .

    Inexplicable and seemingly full of JS hubris. This blows my mind.

    RIP Sarah Walker (1.01-3.07) ????

    • SWnerd says:

      She will be missed. I’m thinking we should all right eulogies, talking about all the good times. Sorry, I’m apparently in a rather sarcastically morbid mood.

    • Fake Empire says:

      I’m feeling ya! IMHO, this season has felt like a slow burn, but now it feels like much of the fanbase, especially the shippers, has to absorb a potentially debilitating body blow to the “produce section” as Chuck would say. All of this after such loyalty, great patience between seasons, and high optimism.

      Head-shakingly unbelievable . . .

    • JLR says:

      This is what pisses me off so much… Look, I’ve said it before–use all the angst you want; keep C/S apart for infinity. I don’t give a #$@! Just please don’t make me dislike the characters in the process. Well, it’s nigh on too late for that. I’m not even a shipper for god’s sake!! Damn I’m so annoyed..

    • kg says:

      Ha ha.

      That was good Empire.

  9. lizjames says:

    Since I’ve come to really dislike TPTB, I don’t think I need to defend what I am about to say: Calm Down! Please.

    Maybe it’ll be awful. Maybe it won’t. Geez, maybe I was right and Sarah hired Hannah to go after Chuck.
    Maybe Sarah does stupid and awful things. Maybe she’s still angry at Chuck and gets even.

    But just do this as we watch this episode: Pay attention to what Sarah Walker DOES NOT say. ESPECIALLY in an Ali Adler episode.

    What the Sarah Walker character says if very often very much less important than what she does say.

    If you guys are going to go for pitchforks and torches, I won’t be with you. I’ll do something more important. I’ll stop watching if they destroy the Sarah character.

    But let’s just listen for what Sarah doesn’t say in this episode. It’s bound to be important.

    • lizjames says:

      By the way, if Adler goes after the fans here, well, just remember that, too. I admire her writing. But if she tells us we take her TV shows too seriously, then we should remember that when they ask for help to save the show for the fourth season. That’s how we prove OUR power.

      But, meanwhile, try to listen to what won’t be said by Sarah in this episode.

    • John says:

      Magnus usually always notices the subtle facial expressions of Sarah. Even he felt disgusted after the episode.

      • JLR says:

        That’s what disturbs me most… Two episodes in a row that DR has more or less panned…and now he’s essentially saying the Sarah character is damaged. He’s typically anti-shipper, and “big picture”, so I’m worried…

    • Fake Empire says:

      Liz: if Sarah is indeed destroyed on Monday, I will be right along with you in refusing to watch any longer. I guess it then becomes a matter of what is the dealbreaker?

      For me, undoubtedly, it would be Sarah sleeping with Shaw so quickly after refusing Chuck’s attempts at just a relationship (not necessarily physical intimacy) for so long.

    • herder says:

      Liz, thank you, and I will do that but it does seem inexplicable that a show on the bubble would do something to make it’s fan base as angry as it could. I don’t blame Ali Adler any more than I blame Phil Klemmer for the Mask, they are staff writers and they have to write to fit the arc that the show runners choose. Having said that I would like to have heard the comments from those who did have an idea of what the reaction of those who watch the show would be at the staff meeting where they discussed this episode.

      Also, it will be interesting to see the damage control they go into after the episode airs, I see a blizzard of good news leaks, happy spoilers and maybe an interview with Mo Ryan, who I suspect has a critical review planned for this episode.

      From the sounds of things this is an episode that will anger not just the “crazy shippers” but a good part of the fan base too. How do they entice an upset audience to stay tuned to what – from all accounts – is one of the best episodes of the series.

      • SWnerd says:

        I can actually picture the writers meeting for this episode and JS asks “So who wants to write this sucker?” Everyone sinks down in their chair and avoids eye contact. After several dead silent minutes, Ali sighs and says “Fine, but you people owe me big time.”

      • JC says:

        I would be shocked if they did interview why Mo Ryan after this episode. If anything it’ll be with Sepinwall and his softball questions.

      • kg says:

        Herder it looks like the damage control was leaked a few days ago. Right?

        We were all stoked and fired up for a great second half based on what we were shown.

        Weeks ago we saw that Sarah, con or not, was going to kiss Shaw. We were not shown any semblance of the ugliness apparantly being thrown our way.

    • kg says:

      Hey Liz

      This apparently is way beyond gloating rights my dear.

      If the speculation garbage is correct, we now NEED it to be a CON.

      I’m pathetic. I’m wishing and praying for a con like a little school girl. LOL.

      • John says:

        Sorry to burst your bubble kg. Magnus shot down the Sarah con theory.

        “If you were to assign odds that some deception is involved with sarah’s actions”

        There is no deception.

  10. Chris says:

    I just feel like venting a little. It seems that a lot of the media has been calling people bothered by the ending of “mask” and what seems to be some characters acting OOC, just some crazy shipper talk.

    I ask who is crazier? The “crazy” shippers or the producers/writers who know how passionate the shippers are, but want to provoke them as much as possible? Is it crazy that some people are invested in the characters and romance part of the show that the producers have pushed so heavily?

    It would seem crazier for the producers of a show, that is always on the bubble for renewal, to tell a story that is as inflammatory as possible and alienate some of their fan base. The producers are taking a risk that some of those shipper fans may not come back even after hinting at things getting better.

    If you damage the characters too much in some fans eyes then why would they want to watch them anymore? That is what I fear.

    Still, I think that what seems to be OOC moments are what has bothered other fans and a lot of shippers too. I know they have bothered me.

    I will still be watching this episode, but I am sure I will be grinding my teeth through it.

    • SWnerd says:

      Yeah, I’ll be watching too but only because it’s like a car wreck: you just can’t look away. Gotta remember to tell my roommates to remove all throwable objects from my immediate reach though.

    • Fake Empire says:

      Chris, you are spot on. It makes absolutely no sense. It feels like a young adolescent who does something self-destructive simply because he/she can.

      • Chris says:

        The hardest thing about all of this is I got a friend and his girlfriend into Chuck by watching season 1 and 2 on DVD before season 3.

        The big thing is they have one of those fabled Nielsen ratings boxes on their TVs. I have made sure that I am at their house every Monday so we are watching it live as a group so it will count in the ratings

        His girlfriend controls the remote in this household. She is a shipper who also enjoys the spy moments and loves the fun feeling of the show. She is about ready to quit and go back to watching “House” after what has happened between Charah and the dark tone. I have to keep pleading with her that it will get better from what we hear. Still it might be a case of “too little to late” with her or it took too long to get good again. I will keep trying to convince her to stay with it.

        My friend doesn’t care about the romance but loves Casey, Jeff and Lester. He is getting upset that they have been minor parts of the show this season. Not sure what to say to him other than there may be a Casey episode in the future.

      • Fake Empire says:

        Uh-oh Chris.

  11. Faith says:

    throw up, throw something

    my plan.

    • Faith says:

      sorry when I get upset I get glib and succinct.

      I am upset. I’m trying hard to channel my positive optimistic mode but boy it’s a struggle.

      I guess all I can say is I’m looking forward to the redemption. By Mo Ryan’s account Scott Rosenbaum put everything he had in 3.9’s Beard and I hope that includes some redemption from a character we have all grown to love and will surely shortly hate.

    • Fake Empire says:

      and then throw-down with any showrunners in sight?

      😉

      • Faith says:

        Jonathan, I can’t say I’m not tempted. I live 15-30 minutes away from LA and the studio, I can totally zip over there and do some damage 😐

      • Fake Empire says:

        If it comes to that, and by chance you pass through the DC area on your way . . . pick me up, because I’m going with you!!

        😉

  12. lizjames says:

    Look, folks, all I am saying is pay attention. It’s not for nothing that we are in a series of episodes named The Mask, The Fake Name and The Beard. I mean, if you believe what you are seeing and taking it at face value, it’s dangerous.

    And look at this from Seat 42f, who tweeted earlier today: “Watched 4 news eps of #Chuck. Without spoiling. The amount of stuff that happens in these eps is gigantic. SO MANY twists/reveals.” It’s here: http://twitter.com/seat42f.

    I don’t even put it past TPTB to write stuff we KNOW they’ll hate and then say, “Well, we explained it four episodes later.” I mean, these people do seem to like to pull the wings off flies.

    But I really do counsel caution. And skepticism. And a VERY careful listening to what is NOT said by Sarah.

    Remember: The Mask. The Fake Name. The Beard. A lot of what we’re seeing now cannot be taken at face value.

    And, frankly, THE TIME TO GET EVEN IS LATER. Don’t lie to yourself. You’re in until 13 no matter WHAT they do. The rage we may feel is MUCH better saved for later, when they need us to fight for renewal. I’m serious. If they are playing with our heads now, the way to get even is when they need us. Then, literally, I suggest we CAN make our help conditional on their behavior going forward.

    If there is raging against the machine to be done, I’ll be at the head of the line. But I prefer to get even, not get loud.

    • Faith says:

      Thanks for the advice Liz. But I gotta tell you it won’t make it any less painful. Because in the end that’s what they wanted and that’s what they’ll get. Their mission is to drag us to the mud, make us feel something beyond what it is we normally feel and in this case I think they’ll succeed. Hopefully not to the point of apathy but just like when you get a tooth-ache you just have to use your tongue to move it and feel it even knowing you’re causing pain…eventually the tooth gets removed. And the pain is replaced with novocaine 😉

      • lizjames says:

        Faith-
        Oh, clearly.

        I have something I’d like to say here, but I promised Joe that I would adopt an old Star Trek line when I am infuriated about what one particular person here posts.

        And I actually think TPTB have invented a way to hit out at the “shippers” and then claim that they haven’t. In other words, elaborate games and twists and turns.

        My guess here is that what we’ll see is an apparent betrayal. After all, if we take the Mask at face value–as someone here claims we should–than Chuck and Sarah moving on SHOULD NOT be a problem for anyone. After all, Sarah is happy for Chuck’s relationship with Hannah and Chuck is okay with Sarah being Shaw.

        So what it will look like, I think, is that Sarah is doing something terrible to Chuck in another way. And I would guess that when all the reveals are in she’s doing it to a) protect Chuck and/or b) hasten his growth as a spy so he can protect himself.

        And, again, for me, I hate how this season is unfolding. I DO NOT find it entertaining, haven’t since Pink Slip. But I truly do think we should ignore this “what you see is what you get” stuff and look deeper.

        We may NOT like it–I already hate it!–but we MIGHT understand the bigger picture.

      • Faith says:

        Totally with you.

        And yeah I agree on the betrayal. All throughout this season they’ve strived to break everything we believed in (with hopes to remake it?) And of all things we’ve learned the most from seasons past one, the most important is that Chuck trusts Sarah most of all and that Sarah will never betray Chuck—even at the risk of her own life/loyalty to her country. Well the (4 letter word) will hit the fan.

        It’ll be agonizing but like I said earlier, I hope the redemption is swift.

    • Matt says:

      I read your post and the whole time I kept staring back at the phrase that had “MANY twists/reveals”. I’m hoping that this was all a scheme and that I can treat it as a bad dream.

    • joe says:

      Liz, you’re a beacon of sanity.

      I recall something. The name first given out for 3.08 many months ago was The Nose. So yes, we had, in order, episodes named The Mask, The Nose and The Beard.

      It’s very telling.

    • kg says:

      Liz you are right. Now, is not the time. We’re all in until at least 13.

      Yes, revenge is a dish best served cold. Right now, we’re hot. Steaming. “I prefer to get even, not get loud.” Brilliant.

      Thank you

    • Ace says:

      Sorry Liz, DR and OD know about the next 4. DR said there was no deception. It was just bad writing. They will probably have Sarah be very open with Shaw and the sharing is with him. I am sure she will treat Chuck like crap as well.

      So I don’t believe for a second that there is some master plan 4 episodes later. What you see is what you get. Sarah will fall for Shaw and Chuck will be in the way. I bet the kiss is after the punch.

      I am not watching this episode until next Sunday if ever. Also the whole wait until 13 I am now going to be very selective which episodes I watch from now on.

  13. Lucian says:

    I didn’t think they could screw up the characters and the story any more than they did in Pink Slip. Sounds like I was wrong. Not to worry – it’s all about the destination!

  14. JLR says:

    Relax folks.. Supposedly things get “epically” better soon… It doesn’t matter if the characters are dragged through the mud; it doesn’t matter if plot holes remain; it doesn’t matter if many of us aren’t feeling entertained. As long as we get a couple nice episodes to re-inject rainbows & sunshine, none of the negatives matter. Right???

  15. JC says:

    What I’m wondering is if this such an emotional episode. How can 3.09 be a fun romp?

    • John says:

      The only way I can see 3.09 changing the mood to epic would be a 180 by both characters ala ending of 3.07.

      • JC says:

        Maybe the bromance heals Chuck’s heart.

        I just worry we’re going to get whiny jealous Chuck at the beginning.

      • weaselone says:

        I’m thinking their will be less whining and more snark on Chuck’s part. He’s going to zing Shaw instead of just whining. Casey’s finally gotten to him.

      • JLR says:

        That we’re told to rely on later episodes to rehabilitate the entire arc bothers me. Guess I just need to go back to watching only sports; get my “drama” in a more unforced way.

      • Faith says:

        They say faith is believing in something even when evidence tells you otherwise.

        In this instance I’m gonna have to rely on crumbling faith. I have faith that Chuck and Sarah deep down regardless of betrayals, hurt, masks, etc…that they still love each other and that love is unbreakable, undeniable, lasting and timeless. Because when it comes down to it I don’t have a choice.

        No pun intended, Faith is just my username, not my real name.

      • Mike B says:

        Faith, isn’t that a line from “Miracle on 34th Street. I think that’s what we need here.

      • kg says:

        Yes Mike. The original.

        John Payne tells Maureen O’Hara, “Faith is believing when common sense tells you not to.”

      • Faith says:

        Good catch! I didn’t even remember where I got it but that is indeed where it’s from. Although KG showing off by listing background information haha, jk.

        Miracles and television tend to go hand and hand. It’s really the only place I can think of where the impossible happens most days/every epi 🙂

      • kg says:

        Faith

        There’s a plethora of talented and passionate folks who write and read on this blog.

        Are you kidding me? Ha ha. It was a very tiny window for me to show off a little.

        Like Chuck describing his first successful solo as a “mish.”

  16. Waverly says:

    Maybe they think that getting the fan base all riled up will increase ratings. People who are violently ambivalent are more likely to watch than those who just don’t care.

    • JLR says:

      Perhaps.. Good thing for TPTB that I don’t have one of those Nielson boxes, because indifference is what will come to me once my disappointment wears off.

    • kg says:

      Back in the day they use to say that a majority of Howard Stern’s audience hated him.

      And that an overwhelming number of those “haters” tuned in simply because they had to hear what he had to say next.

      The only other guy in the media to have such a profound effect in similar fashion was the late Howard Cosell.

    • Ace says:

      Increase ratings when people who just joined the show who have boxes want to leave. Not likely.

      Also I have faith in Jesus Christ, I don’t put my faith in a bunch of people who love to tortue the fan base. They have not delievered so I don’t know what there is to have faith about.

      • Faith says:

        I don’t think anyone is questioning your faith to Jesus, heck I’m catholic and I have faith but that’s religion. I just meant that in a democracy you have faith in your fellow man right? That when the chips are down or not, they’ll do the right thing. Well this is no different. While we’re all frustrated and rightly so (hell I’ll be the first one to complain about the OOC, I hate OOC. I would rather have PLIs up to the wazoo rather than make me hate my beloved characters) —let TPTB right the ship they themselves sunk. After all they gave me the Chuck I loved to begin with. I enjoy Chuck, I think it’s been downright questionable this season (there are many aspects I find distasteful this season) but I will be sticking around because I believe that they will find a way to redeem not only themselves but the characters I fell in love with. I have faith in my fellow man and although they are angst machines they are still human. I think 🙂

  17. atcdave says:

    I may understand why NBC hasn’t been promoting the show much during the Olympics. What would you do with a show you know is going to upset its most loyal fans? I also think this explains the timing of the preview we saw a couple days ago, they’re trying pre-emptive damage control.
    I’ve said before I intend to watch all the way through, but I really am wrestling with skipping this one. I just don’t need the aggravation. I will never understand the mentality of annoying the fans who made you.

  18. BDP says:

    am i the only one with a small pit of pain in my stomach…

    The fight scenes in that bar look pretty amazing though.

    Who knows, maybe there going to have all tripple strike moment for Sarah

    -Hired Hannah to protect/distract chuck
    -Sleeps with Shaw (though tbh 3 years is a long ‘king time)
    -Tells Shaw her real name
    -tortures Chuck… (thoughtbh he’s had 3 years of that).

    Im actually not as upset about the apparent murder of Sarah’s likable character… but more about these dig’s at the fans and there expectation’s about Chuck and Sarah. I dont really have a leg to stand on, i wasn’t around for the save chuck campaign and im not the hugest shipper around…but iv’e been around enough fandom’s to see how passionate people can get, and i dont really get why they want to potentially destroy there own show like this… but maybe thats an over-reaction 500 loud shippers are not as big a number as 5 million casual viewers…

    ^^^
    Hey look i went on a tangent.

    • John says:

      -Still not sure about Hannah…gonna stick with Occam’s Razor and say she’s just a normal civilian.
      -Well according to Magnus, the cardinal rule for Sarah has not been broken.
      -Could happen, but I don’t see the point considering Shaw has read her file (and would therefore know her real name already).
      -no brainer

    • joe says:

      You may have hit at the heart of the matter too, BDP.

    • atcdave says:

      I too have that sick feeling in the pit of my stomach, I’m really not looking forward to this, But:

      – I don’t believe Sarah will actually sleep with Shaw, I think the issue is emotional honesty; Shaw will get more of it after 4 episodes than Chuck has had in three years.

      – I think we may hear Sarah’s name from Shaw, not Sarah. Perhaps she will will tell Chuck later.

      – No matter how bad things look, I’m sure they mean to fix things; that is explain and otherwise make them right in latter episodes.

      – I think the casual fans are the ones most at risk. They don’t follow the spoilers like we do. So they don’t know there’s light at the end of tunnel, and soon.

      • Jason says:

        they essentially have spent the entire arc sabotaging sarah, from the ill conceived idea to run away, to the lets face it living with / sleeping with a mark for 2 months, to hearing the ILU tape and ignoring it, to mother hen protecting chuck but never talking with him privately, to watching him sipping whisky and doing nothing end of 3.6, now to her responding to routh’s awkward advances in probably physical and non-physical ways, as well as possibly betraying chuck in 3.8 – why – because TPTB want her to come running back to chuck – put her in her place as a charace

  19. Stef62 says:

    One word….Dumb

  20. joe says:

    Okay, now that we’re waiting for the coming ‘shipapocalypse, consider something Magnus said in comments (link in the main story)…

    I would say so. 3.08 will likely upset a lot of people and make them think this is going to be the general atmosphere of the rest of the season. It is not.

    For some, I realize that misses the point. For others, that *is* the point.

    – and btw if you haven’t read through at least some of the comments there at Chuckgasmic, you should. The discussion has been excellent. Intense, passionate, well stated and no opinion pro- or con- the way things seem to be developing has been ignored.

    Sounds like here!

    • Faith says:

      I’m gonna stick with Chuckapocalypse 2.0. Mostly because I garner from his initial words and follow up comments that it’s not so much a shipper massacre it’s a character assassination with fanfare.

      • joe says:

        I know what you mean, Faith. But Magnus keeps repeating something that makes no sense if it’s the kind of character assassination that everybody’s thinking of.

        Either I’m missing something, or it’s not exactly what people are expecting.

      • John says:

        “Yeah, the forum fans are very hardcore. And this blog is more for them. The people who don’t go to forums and don’t live and breath these characters will probably not be bothered by it… much.”

      • Faith says:

        LIES!

        They may not be as vocal about it, but some if not most feels like we do. They just have a tendency to act in a way that matters most: turn it off and be done with it.

    • JC says:

      If it is that bad, how can there be a happy ending by 3.13? Unless they really let go and C/S call each other out on the BS between them. Adult angst not the typical teenage type we’ve gotten before.

      Even if that happens that leaves four episodes for them to reconnect and become a couple. Not counting the Ring storyline. I just don’t see it.

  21. joe says:

    Since this is now the official spoiler thread, I’ll put this here. It may shed light on what we are about to endure.

    NBC has released the official synopsis of 3.10 Chuck vs. The Tic Tac

    CHUCK VERSUS THE TIC TAC”

    03/15/2010 (08:00PM – 09:00PM) (Monday) : CHUCK AND SARAH MUST CLEAR CASEY’S GOOD NAME- ROBERT PATRICK (“Terminator 2: Judgment Day”) GUEST STARS –Casey (Adam Baldwin) carries out a side mission for his old commanding officer James Keller (guest star Robert Patrick) that leads to him committing treason. When Chuck (Zachary Levi) learns the dark truth about Col. Keller, he and Sarah (Yvonne Strahovski) set out to break Casey out of jail and clear his name. Meanwhile, Awesome’s (Ryan McPartlin) plan to keep Ellie (Sarah Lancaster) out of danger gets more difficult when she gets her dream fellowship. Joshua Gomez also stars.

    Read more: http://www.spoilertv.com/2010/02/chuck-episode-310-chuck-versus-tic-tac_27.html#ixzz0ghULy7DR

    • BigCheese says:

      This would probably be a great episode as well as 309 if Chuck and Sarah are like the old times.

      What I hope to be.

      • atcdave says:

        You all know I’m no defender of the stupidity we’ve had to sit through this season; but I do think we need to take the 3.10 episode description for what it is. That is, good news. Chuck and Sarah will be working together (no Shaw at all in this episode), and I believe restoring their trust and relationship.

        I think it was terrible miscalculation by TPTB to tear Chuck and Sarah apart for so much of this season, and it breaks my heart that it gets worse before it gets better; but it will get better.

  22. JC says:

    3.08 the big romantic fallout.
    3.09 seems like C/S won’t have much interaction.
    3.10 they’re working as a team.

    Color me confused.

    • joe says:

      Yes, that’s why I put the 3.10 synopsis up, JC.

      One of the three can’t be the way you described. My best guess is that it’s 3.09. Something is planted late in 3.08 that we don’t see until the end of 3.09.

      • JC says:

        Unless they put aside things to save Casey. It could be cold between them or at least from Chuck. Things like calling her Walker instead of Sarah.

      • John says:

        Well this kills all the Sarah con speculations.

        “If you were to assign odds that some deception is involved with sarah’s actions”

        There is no deception.

      • OldDarth says:

        As I said before – keep the Chuck storylines simple.

        I agree with JC, 3.10 is when they start working as a team. 3.08 is the low point. 3.09 Chuck starts rebuilding his world beginning with squaring things with Morgan.

  23. Merve says:

    A few things:

    – Almost all of you haven’t seen the episode yet.

    – If you watch the episode with the expectation and mindset of being disappointed, you probably will be disappointed.

    – TPTB aren’t giving you the finger. They aren’t out to get you. They’re just trying to tell what they think is the most entertaining story. Whether it actually is the most entertaining story is for you to decide.

    – It probably won’t be that bad.

    Hey, if it sucks, I’ll complain with everyone else. But I’ll reserve judgement until I’ve actually seen the episode.

    Oh yeah, one more thing: isn’t JS less involved than he was in previous seasons? Shouldn’t we be blaming all this drama on CF? (I’m also basing this on the fact that CF originally envisioned Chuck as a drama/thriller and that JS suggested turning it into a comedy.)

    • joe says:

      You’re right, Merve. But today, people need to vent. That’ll be true for a little while yet.

      • JC says:

        Alot of it has to do with the source. When he says he was disgusted by some of the Sarah elements, pushed things too far and saying he’ll pretend the episode never happened. That made people take notice.

    • weaselone says:

      Merve, the interesting thing is that DR posted this in order to desensitize fans to what was coming up. The general idea is that by wallowing in the worst scenarios our imaginations can conjure that when we see the show although we’ll react negatively, it won’t be with the same intensity. We will have been inoculated against the most extreme of our reactions.

  24. weaselone says:

    I’m probably going to be reminding myself throughout the show that in Empire, Leia plants a passionate kiss on her brother to win a petty argument with Han.

    At this point I wouldn’t consider any sort of physical activity between Chuck and Hannah or Sarah and Shaw as particularly damaging to the characters. They’ve both accepted the break up and each has received the other’s permission to move on. So if Chuck engages in heavy make out scenes with Hannah and Sarah beds Shaw, it wouldn’t really phase me. Although for those of you that worry about that sort of thing, DR makes it fairly clear that Sarah and Shaw don’t got that far.

    My suspicion is that when DR refers to Sarah acting out of character it likely refers to one or both of two things.
    1. She warms up to Shaw and begins to share her past, feelings and emotions with him way too quickly. This would break with everything we’ve scene from this character over the last 2.5 seasons. This is a woman who jealously guards her past and her feelings. To let someone in after such a short time, particularly given that when she opened herself the last time, she was burned is completely character shattering.
    2. She undermines and/or deliberately attempts to hurt Chuck. This contradicts anything we’ve ever seen from Sarah. Although she takes a few cheap shots at him in the opening two episodes and seems to have adopted the roll of overprotective mother, she generally has always had his best interests at heart.

    • Paul says:

      DR stated the Sarah rule will not be broken, so physical intimacy beyond making out is highly unlikely to happen. I believe that the name reveal will likely be a S/S interaction. While to me that is not a big deal as long as it fits the overall story, MANY folks will go ballistic over that.

      • JC says:

        And people would have a legitimate complaint if that happens. It goes against what the writers have established for the two and half seasons. That just screams lazy writing to me.

        My only concern is Chuck being a punching bag once again. He needs to man up and not just by punching Shaw. Hopefully he calls both of them out on things. Shaw’s wife and Sarah’s past would be good targets.

      • Mike B says:

        TPTB are the ones that built up the whole mystery of Sarah’s real name and they know it has been a big topic for the fan base. If it is revealed in a casual way or not to Chuck then that is TPTB sticking their tongue out at the fan base.

      • SWnerd says:

        Agree ^^

        They built this plot point of Chuck wanting to know real things about Sarah and if they use the name reveal as an S/S moment instead of a C/S moment, it just undermines everything.

      • joe says:

        Well, yeah SW. But didn’t “they” make a point of Chuck not needing to know more?

        That may truly be a place where it’s us, not them.

      • weaselone says:

        I’d actually given that some thought as well, Joe and came to the conclusion that whether Shaw or Chuck hears the name is rather unimportant as it regards the relationship between Chuck and Sarah. If Sarah tells Chuck, then it demonstrates the level of comfort and trust that still exists between them. If Sarah tells Shaw, it demonstrates that Chuck is satisfied and content simply knowing who Sarah is now while Shaw needs to know her secrets.

        The problem would be that Sarah has established herself as someone who is very protective of her past and her emotions, unwilling to be particularly open even to the man that’s captured her heart. Unless there is some sort of strange spy story twist that forces Sarah to divulge her name, Sarah willingly giving up this piece of information is completely outside of her established character, particularly given that she still hasn’t gotten over being burned the last time she opened up.

      • joe says:

        Well, that’s well put, Weasel. It’s doesn’t challenge Chuck’s character, but it challenges Sarah’s.

        I can buy that.

        But I’ve lost track. Understanding that we don’t know who finds out, are we still assuming it’s Sarah’s name that’s revealed (or was that in a spoiler somewhere? Sorry. Ignorant.)
        And even so. Is there room for a Truth like ending?

      • weaselone says:

        Not certain. I’ve been trying to stay away from some of the most revealing spoilers. I’m not sure if Sepinwall confirmed this on his site, or whether it’s just speculation based on the title of the episode.

  25. Rick Holy says:

    Well, we’ll see what happens come Monday night. If it proves to be what it is being conjectured to be, that will be unfortunate. I’m a hoping it won’t.

    Shipper or not, the really sad thing for me is that this season had all the hype, all the promotion, etc. The table was set for CHUCK to if not become a “hit,” then to at least grow a little. The “ball” was in the hands of TPTB.

    But truthfully – compare this season to season 2 or even season 1. I’ll put it bluntly. THE STORYTELLING THIS SEASON HAS FLAT OUT SUCKED. Shipper, non-shipper, somewhere-in-between, it’s been an extremely lame if not downright miserable season.

    What used to be automatically “fun” to watch on Monday nights now takes great effort to watch and to find the “fun” – which in most episodes has been substantially lacking.

    Remember this. This was only supposed to be a 13 episode season. If we get through 8 episodes, or even 9 with things continuing like they have been, then the writers have simply FAILED to produce the season that the fans deserved. They’ve regressed in their storytelling – and it shows itself PAINFULLY in most of this season’s episodes.

    A 2 or 3 episode “pay off” of some sort (still not even sure what that means) at the end of the 13 episode story arc? Honestly. How pathetic can you get??

    I’ll likely hang on until the end – but I’m with the person(s) who’ve said previously on this thread that they’ll never invest another minute of their lives watching a Josh Schwartz created/produced show again (even if it DOES feature Kristin Kreuk, who I happen to think ROCKS).

    Compare that to J.J. Abrams – who brought us ALIAS and LOST. Anything that has his name on it I’ll check out because the guy knows how to tell a good – if not extremely complicated – story. Sorry to say it’s not the same with J.S.

    Am I being angry, bitter, petty? No. I’m being a television consumer. Serve me up a crappy steak once at a restaurant and I’ll probably keep quiet. Serve me up a crappy steak on my next visit, and I’ll tell you about it. This season on Chuck I’ve had a few too many crappy steaks – so I’m hoping that my eighth “visit” won’t be another one.

    What I had hoped for from this season which HAD so much promise was some decent entertainment and a solid story line that did not duplicate s1 and s2, but at least kept with the overarching theme of the show. I wasn’t expecting anything “outstanding,” mind you, but decent. Again, episode for episode, compare S3 to S2 (or even S1). There’s simply no comparison. It’s like the air’s been let out of the balloon – and all the balloon is doing now is making that kind of farting sound until it falls to the ground and dies.

    Hopefully the ballon can be re-inflated — and the same mistakes won’t be made again in S4 – if we should be so lucky as to get one after this kind of S3.

    • Ace says:

      I think there have been too many rotten steaks and I fear that while 3.09 is going to be good people will quit the show in 3.08.

      So I see declining ratings and no season 4. Enjoy the last 12 episodes of Chuck starting Monday. I am not getting a good feeling of this and they cannot blame anyone but themselves. They had a golden oppertunity and are pooching it big time. Sigh..

      By the time we get back to the good stuff the audience growth will have eroded. NBC is not going to give JS another oppertunity.

    • BigCheese says:

      Rick Holy I understand your feeling. I am a shipper fanatic. I do not understand why such a painful choice. Season 1 and 2 was amazing.

      But do not feel right to say how things should be. What I can do is express my opinion on what I saw or what is to come.

      What scares me is not having enough viewers to have a season 4. But in the end I will be there, even though I deeply regret it.

    • atcdave says:

      Great rant Rick. I like your balloon analogy, it is so true. A brilliant show through two seasons; this year most episodes have no replay value at all for me. They’ve even sucked the fun out of what came before.

      • Lucian says:

        Something I figured out a while ago which makes this season much more enjoyable to watch; that is, I don’t consider this the third season of “Chuck”. This is the first season of a new show which is a sequel to Chuck. New tone, characters have no history, no previous story line, etc. Nothing that happened prior to Prague is particularly relevant. This isn’t what I think they should have done, but it will drive you less crazy when they do things that don’t seem to make sense, given the show we came to love.

        This new show is pretty good; the old show was (IMO) outstanding. Though I would like to see season 4 as a return to the old show, I am guessing it will be more of a continuation of this one (if they make it to season 4).

  26. OldDarth says:

    Alias floundered after the first 2 seasons for the record.

  27. Faith says:

    weaselone, drinking game? INSPIRED!

    • weaselone says:

      I’m just a little leery. I want to be conscious at the end of the episode and I have to work the next day so the rules will need to be finely calibrated.

  28. Jen says:

    I’m gonna stick to this answer DR gave “TS, without spoiling anything… you won’t have to wait too long to fall in love with Chuck and Sarah all over again. :)”

    So here we go again, we are facing more OOC, more stuff we will dislike and apparently we will be disgusted with what Sarah does. Guys, i propose we stay calm and wait out the storm. We know we love the show and the characters and will watch… we will have to wait and see where Sarah’s actions are coming from and maybe do as Liz said and pay attention to what Sarah is NOT saying. I’m just gonna suck it up and put up with this next ep since supposedly things will get better soon and i’ll be in love w C/S again soon. I, of course, as all of you, don’t agree at all with what’s being done, but i know i’ll watch anyway, so i’ll suck it up and wait. This is where i keep telling myslef “it’s just a tv show… it’s just a tv show…” I hope the mantra works…
    The payoffs sound pronmising for later this season and season 4, so let’s try to make sure we get there 🙂
    At least i’m glad that Sarah won’t be sleeping w Shaw. The thought grossed me out. I’m leaning towards some apparent betrayl of some sort.

    • Fake Empire says:

      You know, Jen, one thing I was thinking a little earlier once I began to calm down was: TPTB are pretty good at kicking me metaphorically where I don’t like to be kicked (even metaphorically), but they’re actually also pretty darn good at redeeming storylines that bothered me. Colonel redeeming Beefcake stands out. So, if Fake Name is Beefcake on steroids, then I will hope for a juiced-up Colonel coming soon.

      I echo your thoughts on Sarah/Shaw and am grateful it appears to have been ruled out. The image of them together is unnerving – Blech!!!

      • Jen says:

        Let’s keep the eye on the prize! Even if it hurts right now to get to it. I wonder if we’ll even be thinking at the end that TPTB are geniuses… I don’t think we will, but who knows. It pains me to not find the characters believeable, but we know we will all be there for the end…. So let’s just wait n see.

        Speculaing about all the possible scenarios is fun n being able to vent is like therapy, and it’s great we can do it here openly… But let’s also encourage one another to stick it out, it seems we’ll be very happy if we do.

        And I’d the end is Colonel in steroids I DEFINITLEY want to be watching n waiting for a season 4.

        I don’t fins Routh attractive, so starting there, the thought of S/S made me do a grossed out face. As a woman, Its like seeing a friend who happens to be in love w somene else go sleep w some other dude. That is disturbing. I’m glad it’s not that.

        I’m also glad that the love question is not from this ep and the horrible thing Sarah does is not lie to Chuck and tell him now, to keep lying to herself in the process.

      • joe says:

        …The horrible thing Sarah does is not lie to Chuck and tell him now.

        It dawned on me this morning that we saw that in S1. Under pentathol, Sarah *does* the horrible thing, lies to Chuck, and he goes off for 2 episodes with Lou.

        In retrospect that should have been every bit as disheartening. I don’t recall the fans having this kind of reaction, though, or myself, for that matter. Was it because we didn’t know the characters as well then? Or, perhaps we weren’t so invested?

      • atcdave says:

        Joe, I remember not liking the Lou story either; but it was so early both for the characters and their relationship the feeling was no where near as strong. S2 in general, Colonel in particular, changed everything for me; apparently not so much to the writers.

      • Jen says:

        Hey Joe (like the song = P) After Colonel anything between C/S has more weight… And by then I think we were so fully invested in their relationship that Colonel was like the cherry on top n felt like a relief. Then we got the rug swept from under us n we r still on the floor trying to get up.

      • joe says:

        Jen – I LOVE the song.
        In the pantheon of guitar pickers Hendrix has very few equals and no superiors.

      • Jen says:

        Hendrix was the man n I’m so sad he died so young… I’m a huge fan n a fan of pretty much all guitar players… I’m a sucker for a guy s a guitar.

    • weaselone says:

      I think I’ll be OK. I’m willing to give Sarah a lot of leeway when it comes to physical expressions of affection. It’s been a long drought for her, she’s not attached to anyone, has Chuck’s permission and turnabout is fair play. Anything else, I’ll just chalk up to the lingering effects of her adverse reaction to the nerve agent she was exposed to last week. She seemed to be more strongly effected than Shaw, so perhaps she has a particularly sensitive and reacts unusually to that particular substance.

      • Jen says:

        Maybe one of the eide effects of the drug was some sort of brain disfunction… That could explain Sarah’s actions!

        Maybe all those falls have affected Chuck’s and we r seeing the symptoms here in S3!

      • Faith says:

        Jen: then she could have amnesia afterwards! The angst tri-fecta. Heartbreak, amnesia, devastation…Epic! NOT lmao.

        Wouldn’t it be something though? I mean if they’re shooting for angst and teen soap opera, Amnesia is the way to go. I can’t tell you how often angsty soap-era-ish shows uses the amnesia pill heck even Lois and Clark: the new adventures of superman, which was not a teen show (same demographic I would say of Chuck) used it and people tuned in! Up to a point haha.

      • Jen says:

        Faith… LOL!!! I think maybe they are holding on to amnesia for S4… cause if they pull anothe PLI situation i will have to hurt somebody!

  29. Paul says:

    Hey everyone, do yourselves a favor: Watch the episode first, THEN freak out (if you are so inclined). All this working yourselves up without even watching it does no one any good.

    • joe says:

      Heh. Hi, Paul. I think I’ve seen your handle before, but I’m not certain. If this is your first post, welcome.

      Not to disagree with you right off the bat, but to me, people seem pretty restrained. We’re fans, and there’s no denying we’re passionate about the show (and people here write so darn well!) so the words can come off as pretty intense.

      This *is* a place to vent, after all. And right now, I’m encouraging that! So considering I’ve seen, like, almost nothing that can be construed as “Goodbye, Cruel World” posts, my take is that there’s a lot of rational thinking going on. Letting off steam may indeed do many people some good.

      • Paul says:

        Hi Joe, thanks for the welcome. I’ve only started reading this blog site for a few days now. It’s a neat place.

        However, as a newcomer here, but not a newcomer to fan sites, the whole vibe I’m getting from these posts is “OMG the sky is falling”. I totally understand that people are heavily invested in the show and in the characters. I am too. But agian, what I am seeing IMHO is panic. And it seems to be feeding into itself. Again, I don’t know the posting personalities of the regulars here yet, but that is what I am getting from my fresh set of eyes. Just my $0.02…

      • atcdave says:

        I think we’re all upset; many of us have been all season. But we also things are likely to turn around quickly, so we’re sticking it out. I’ve seen very few posters say “I’m done with it!” But I think its fair game to be upset with the show and writers for the season they’ve given us. We are making our displeasure loud and clear. I promise you, we’ll have a different tone if they fix this. That doesn’t mean I’ll ever like the first part of this season, but I will let my anger go if they make it right (really, I’m good at that).

  30. Fake Empire says:

    I wonder if an OOC moment will occur if/when Sarah actually comes to the defense of Shaw after Chuck punches him, being tender toward Shaw and hostile toward Chuck . . .

  31. Jason says:

    I was the one who asked DR about the odds of deception or a sarah con going on, DR’s answer was there is none, also, Old darth, who I would guess has not seen the screeners but does have his finger on the pulse IMO, has always warned us that what we see is what we are going to get

    so I would assume in 3.9 – 3.11 (very likely in 3.9), CS come to terms with 3.1 thru 3.8 in a clear, simple manner, that apparently is good enough for CS and apparently was ‘good enough’ for DR and, who tells us 3.9 – 3.11 are very good. I sort of am OK with 3.8 being bad, whatever it is will be over with and the show can move on.

    What has already happened 3.1-3.7 clearly took from me the show I wanted, sounds like 3.8 will take the show away from many others that they wanted, all that is left for me is ‘Can I enjoy the show the writers want to tell enough to continue watching?’

    My guess is the answer is yes I will continue to enjoy TPTB’s version of chuck, but I would have enjoyed a shipper friendly 3.1 thru 3.8 far more version far more, as well as a more warmth, comedy, less drama version going forward.

    Will be interesting how this all plays out.

    1 – will the show going forward be fun again chuck S1/S2 – centric, or continue to be OC-centric (because lets face it, 3.1 thru 3.8 has been)

    2 – 2.2M viewers for e3.7, what will chuck-apocalypse 3.7 do to 3.8 (I always thought it might help – not so sure now), what will chuck-apocalypse 3.8 do to 3.9? What will the promise of 3.9 and beyond do to 3.9 and beyond?

    3 – will 3.9 – 3.19 even be any good?

    4 – what will my dreaded papa B – reset do to what probably will be a pretty ‘sweet’ status of the show in 3.19?

    5 – if season 4 goes back to PLI’s for CS, what then, or are TPTB correct, there are 500 crazy shippers and 6 million people who love that sort of thing?

    sorry for the length – good luck to all viewing 3.8

    • joe says:

      I was the one who asked DR…

      Thought that was you, Jason!

      • OldDarth says:

        Hi Jason.

        Yes, I have not seen the screeners.

        I do feel fairly comfortable with what I have been stating here though ie keep the Chuck story lines simple.

        My prediction right now based on what it is out there in the episode synopses and promos is that Chuck and Sarah will start reconnecting in 3.10.

    • atcdave says:

      Great post Jason, thanks for the info. I do think ratings will be down for 3.08; NBC hasn’t promoted the show at all, and many viewers were disappointed by Mask. But I think we can start rebuilding, just as Chuck himself does afterwards. For myself, I’m planning on pushing the show hard again with my friends, AFTER 3.08.

  32. Lucian says:

    I was hoping that we might get a short reprieve from the chronic angst of this season of discontent. I’m okay with both Chuck and Sarah finding love and happiness in the warm embrace of others. Let’s face it, they have had lots and lots of time to figure their relationship out, and clearly, they can’t. I might be one of the few people who actually enjoys this episode. They both agreed to move on, let them move on. Chuck and Hannah are a great couple. Shaw and Sarah, not so much. Routh doesn’t have it.

    • eaglemmoomim says:

      I’ve rewatched all of the S3 episodes at least three times and a few of them five times. I’ve really enjoyed it so far. I’m not in the crazzzzeee group of shippers. I love both of the characters and what makes Sarah interesting is that on the page originally I suspect she was a little one dimensional but YS’s performance has ‘deepened’ the character and now the writers are giving YS much more emotional material to work with as its very much her forte.

      I’m interested to see what made DR feel disgusted by some of Sarah’s actions in the episode. Given that Ausiello has said that there will be a lot of Hannah and Chuck making out I expect that Sarah is going to get angrier and angrier until she explodes at Chuck and does something/says something hurtful to him which leads to Chuck’s inability to flash.

      Apparently they do talk and have a discussion about expectations so I’m thinking that Sarah throws Prague in his face along the lines of ‘did you really think you could leave me for six months and expect everything to go back to the way it was’.

      I also remember seeing that the ending was bitter sweet so I imagine that Sarah and Shaw might have a discussion about Chuck with Sarah being honest to Shaw about her feelings for Chuck after Shaw has been laid out by Chuck and using that as an excuse not to go too far with Shaw. 3.07 and 3.08 is the Empire Strikes Back so as long as 3.09 and 3.10 don’t have ewoks in it I’ll be ok.

      • weaselone says:

        Have you watched seasons one and two in their entirety?

      • eaglemmoomim says:

        Yes WeaselOne I have watched both S1 and S2 many times.

        However I like season 3. I didn’t mind the WTWT of the previous seasons however just having them apart is fine for me right now. Having Chuck dealing with being a real spy and the darker tone of the show works. If they had kept the jokey theme of S1 then now that Chuck is an actual agent in training it wouldn’t have the feeling of costs and consequences that it does now. I know a lot of fans are not liking this new direction but the tone being a little bit more like Alias before it got bogged down in crazee ness is I think a good idea going forward as soon Chuck will be a full agent and having him deal with the reality of Sarah’s world needs to have a bit more punch to it than the rather light weight and flighty season 1.

      • weaselone says:

        My question was only to get a feel for where you were coming from. I’m not particularly horrified by what has happened this season to date with the exception of what they pulled in the last 10 minutes of the Mask which had appeared like it was going to finish as one of the strongest episodes of the season and there less than skillfully handled reset of the relationship in 3.01. To me it just smacks of bad story telling when characters step so far out of line of what was established over the first 2 seasons.

        For example, you noted that you expected Sarah to lay out her emotions regarding Chuck to Shaw. That doesn’t fit with the Sarah we’ve seen over the last 2.5 seasons. She can’t even honestly tell Chuck what she’s feeling, but she opens up to Shaw, a guy she just met a few weeks ago, with whom she’s had a rocky relationship up through the last episode, and who just happens to be her superior. She’s spent the first half of the season hurting because she exposed her heart, if anything she’ll be even more cautious about exposing something real.

      • Jason says:

        eagle – as someone who is sort of liking / getting season 3, what do you think of the shaw – sarah chemistry?

  33. ReadySet says:

    I think it’s important that something be said here.

    Only the most credulous observer now thinks that Chuck and Sarah won’t be together by e13, the original season end. It’s clear that the showrunners, a little panicked by falling ratings, let us know that with the incredibly detailed casting calls for e14 and e15. So this stuff is OVER by e13.

    So regardless of whether you adopt the “nothing is real in the spy world” patter from Pink Slip and assume that lots of stuff is going to be revealed in the next few episodes that will change our perception of what we’ve already seen or whether you adopt the “what you see is what you get” mantra and the story we’ve seen so far IS the story, we KNOW that this all leads to a “happy ending” for Chuck and Sarah in e13.

    That leaves you with the following questions:
    1) Is ANYONE buying any of this as good storytelling?
    2) Why did the showrunners adopt the ONE approach to telling the stories that would make a large chunk of the hard-core base of fans unhappy?
    3) If the showrunners are smarter than the fans, why are the ratings plunging from a very decent start to the back-on-the-bubble numbers we saw for Mask?
    4) Why would ANYONE have confidence that the showrunners won’t break up Chuck and Sarah in season 4 and, rather than pursue the PLI angles again, just have them angry and hurting each other and apart?
    5) What logical business sense has there been this season to minimize the show’s best asset–the onscreen chemistry between Levi and Strahovski–by keeping them off the screen together so much? Surely there was a storyline that would have maximized the on-screen chemistry and still let them tell the story.
    6) Why SHOULD any fan work to save the show next time when the showrunners have shown they want to maximize the fans’ pain, tell stories in the least fan-friendly way–and minimize their best business asset?

    • Jason says:

      yep – spot on. I don’t think the reaction will be as bad for 3.8 as 3.7- magnus sure helped that, but in the past, fans were still invested thereby angry at OOC action, at some point, they stop caring, for some that line has already been crossed, for others, we are closing in on the point – once past that line, few will invest the emotion they once did toward “chuck’ or CS & will essentially leave TPTB ‘alone’ to tell their story, kind of like the little ‘schwartz’ who cried wolf, and you know what happened to schwartz and the villagers in that story?

      • Lucian says:

        I think it is reasonable to say that many of us are not nearly as invested in the story and the characters as we once were. They had something special going for two seasons. Now, not so much. Still good, not great (IMO).

    • Mike B says:

      My sentiments exactly.

    • atcdave says:

      Well put ReadySet. I do love this setting and characters when its working well, hopefully we’ll see that happen again in few weeks; but this season must surely go down as a colossal strategic error. Hopefully, if they get an S4, the network or studio will pay more attention to how the franchise is being (mis)handled. As it stands now, I wouldn’t say one word to give this show another season, but I do expect that to change.

      • ReadySet says:

        atcdave: Nothing can change it for me. I mean, I’ll watch. But I want the show to end now at the end of 3.19. There is NO reason to think these guys can or want to change their style.

    • Anonymous says:

      All hail ReadySet. You have totally nailed every objection a lot of us have had this season.

      And do you notice that the apologists for TPTB have suddenly stopped telling us enjoy the ride because it’s the journey not the destination? Suddenly, they are ALL about the destination…

    • JC says:

      I just wanted to add a few things.

      Will C/S being together be believable by 3.13?
      If 3.08 does damage the Sarah character will be people care by 3.13?
      How will it be handled?

      I’d actually prefer them not getting together until the back six. Sure they could be in better place by 3.13 but I can’t see them a couple. Thats unless they do another ten minute flip again at some point. Which to be would be even worse the second time around.

    • Merve says:

      I’m not trying to play devil’s advocate here. These are my honest answers to your questions:

      1) For me, most of season 3 has had excellent story telling. Aside from the Prague scene (which I think was about a minute too short, contained too much awkward dialogue, and didn’t explain Chuck’s motivations well) and the last 10 minutes or so of “Mask,” I’ve really enjoyed the story. It’s putting the characters through a lot of interesting situations. I like it.

      2) Because the show has fans, other than hardcore fans, who really don’t care that much about PLIs.

      3) Because shows’ ratings tend to drop a bit until midseason. Also, one would expect a drop in ratings to occur for the episode following a bad one, so by that logic, the “bad” episode would be “Nacho Sampler.” (Actually, that’s understandable. Reaction to that episode was sharply divided. Some fans hated the episode. Others – like me – put it in their top 5.)

      4) Because (and I’m sorry that I can’t dig up the source at the moment) the show’s creators have said that the C/S plot will be resolved this season. They’ve already explored Chuck and Sarah “broken up.” It doesn’t make sense to explore that again. They have other stories to tell. Also (and I’m sorry that I can’t dig up the source at the moment) the show’s creators have said that they can only draw from the PLI well so many times before it runs dry.

      5) I don’t have a great answer to this question, and I think that out of all your concerns, it’s one of the better ones. But I’ll give my honest (and incredibly unpopular) opinion nonetheless. I really don’t care much about the Chuck/Sarah romance. For me, their scenes together range from mildly annoying to somewhat entertaining. There have been a couple of good ones – the endings of “Break Up” and “Lethal Weapon” come to mind – but for me, C/S scenes are kind of, well, meh. Personally, I’m glad that I’m seeing how they develop as people apart from each other. For me, it’s something new and fresh. I can understand why it’s frustrating for some people, but I like it.

      6) If you feel that way, then you’re not obligated to save the show. Heck, you’re not even obligated to watch. But if there are fans who enjoy what’s going on right now – and there are – then they should work to save the show that they enjoy.

      • ReadySet says:

        Merve-
        I was talking to this fan base and the readership of this blog in particular. And I think you’d at least agree that YOU are in the distinct minority here in terms of the progress of season three and what they expect for the characters.

        But that is ABSOLUTELY your right. I support your right to love this season.

        That said, facts are facts:
        1) The drop in rating for Chuck is following the Season 2 pattern. Strong start, brief plateau, then a precipitous drop as the stories get told. Right now, despite all of the pre-season promo, Chuck is at 2.2, just where it was at season 2 from mid-season on.

        2) Please don’t believe what TPTB say about knowing when to stop going to the Chuck and Sarah “not a couple.” Their promise about Season 3 offering the resolution should be viewed in the light of their claim that Colonel would be the point of no return for Chuck and Sarah. And that, of course, was a lie. They were coupled for EXACTLY one scene, then broken up at the beginning of the next episode. And you CAN break up the couple in season 4 without bringing in PLIs. These guys parse their words pretty carefully. PLIs aren’t required for a break-up.

        3) If you don’t get the Levi-Strahovski chemistry, that’s cool. But you should know that it IS the talk of TV land. The pros, I mean. Everyone admits these two actors have that special something on-screen together. Again, that DOES NOT mean the characters have to be coupled, but smart showrunners maximize the assets they have. They should have figured a way to keep Levi and Straohovski on screen together for max time, even if they didn’t make the characters a couple. That’s just good business.

        And, seriously, if you’re enjoying season 3, have at it. Enjoy!

      • Anonymous says:

        Merve,
        In the main, I’m with you on Season 3. I’ve said in previous posts that it’s panned out in pretty much the way I expected after Ring and Chuck’s reintersection – and that has made the season easier for me to swallow than for others. I say that too as a confirmed shipper, in the sense that the relationships on the show (all of them, not just Chuck and Sarah) are the thing that makes this show exceptional for me.
        Having said all of that, in terms of storytelling and believable character development, I found Pink Slip as an episode indefensible (even as I accepted the basic premise of the reset and the relationship estrangement) and the same with the last 10 minutes of Mask – assuming that there is no con going on. They are indefensible to me because they have characters acting so far out of character that you call into question all that has gone before. The story has to fit the characters, not the other way round. If you trash the characters, then all you’re left with is a show with wafer thin spy plots, cartoonish vilains, some humour and good music. I might watch that show – but I wouldn’t care about it, and it would be forgotten 5 minutes after I turned off the TV.
        TPTB have a huge problem. They have alienated the diehard C and S shippers from 10 minutes into the season, and it looks like they are on the verge of losing a decent chunk of people like me, who were prepared to buy the premise of Season 3 and cut them some slack.
        Like everyone else, I’m in for the season, but I’ve never watched a season of TV where the show runners seem to be so determined to cut off their nose to spite their face, and I have to say it makes increasingly little sense to me.

      • Merve says:

        ReadySet,

        What you said about the ratings is correct. I’d attribute the drops to the same thing that caused the ratings for S2 to drop. The problem is, I don’t know what that thing is.

        I never said that I didn’t understand the Levi-Strahovski chemistry. They make scenes that would otherwise be annoying somewhat enjoyable. But it’s my personal opinion that the kind of scenes that feature Chuck and Sarah together aren’t my favourite kind of scenes in the show. That’s why the decreased Chuck-Sarah interaction isn’t an issue for me.

  34. Ofer says:

    My concern with 3.07 and what is anticipated in 3.08 is that we are asked to suspend our “investment” in the characters, because it will all work out in the end. So, I wonder, why alter the characters in the first place?

    My second concern is despite what is available from spoilers, how can we then believe that the epic payoff will not be thrown out the window in the future?

    While I think there is still potential to have many dramatic and comedic plots with our favourite couple together, it the back of my mind, I will always think that the showrunners/writers may decide to separate them for lack of a better idea.

  35. Rick Holy says:

    You know what the definition of a “real” Chuck-a-holic is? It’s a peson like me, who after loving the show so much, promoting the heck out of it in every way possible that a person like me can – and then find myself being EXTREMELY disappointed in it this season – will STILL be sitting in front of the TV on Monday a few minutes before 7 p.m. with my Subway footlong in hand, really and truly caring about the show and hoping, HOPING that 3.08 will actually turn out to be a decent episode – even after the spoilers and critics who are “in the know” have had less than positive things to say about it.

    It’s getting harder and harder for me this season to keep “Facebooking,” “Twittering,” and “emailing” friends to “watch CHUCK on Monday night for some GREAT, ENTERTAINING television!”

    But like the person who tips the whiskey bottle too much even though they know it’s not good for them; like the person who gorges themselves on Twinkees even though they know it’s not good for them; and like the smoker who goes all out and smokes the non-filtered really nasty kind of cigs even though they know it’s REALLY not good for them, there I’ll be on Monday night – watching, and telling myself that maybe, JUST MAYBE, I won’t be disappointed.

    My name is Rick – and I’m a CHUCKAHOLIC.

    Lord, help me!

    • weaselone says:

      Well, the first step is admitting you have a problem. Personally, I think atcdave and others have the right idea. This week might not be the best week to promote to potential new viewers.

    • Faith says:

      Good stuff 🙂

      For the harder and harder part though, do you know anyone that love the angst? Maybe teenagers? That would go over well lol. Seriously though I know this girl that watches Gossip Girl (of all things!) and I recently turned her into Chuck. Although to be fair she’s not a teenager and what she loves with Chuck the most is the music and ZL but she doesn’t deny that GG and all the things that go in there is her guilty pleasure.

    • Rick Holy says:

      Well, I’m looking at it this way. Come Monday night, it will be me, my footlong, and my TV. But none of my friends will be with me.

      I can put up with all of the awful you-know-what that goes with being a Chuckaholic – that’s something I brought upon myself – but I have a feeling based on what I’m hearing (the proof will again be in the pudding) – that I won’t after episoe 8 in good conscience be able to draw my friends into it any longer.

      If it turns out as bad as they’re predicting, there won’t be anymore Facebooking, emailing, or Twittering inviting others to join me in my addiciton. I’ll wallow in my own misery by my lonesome, thank you. To continue to invite others into it would simply be unconscionable – kind of like the story arc so far this season – and I won’t be able to do it any longer.

      Sad thing is – I just bought S1 & S2 and am having it shipped down to Mexico to some friends south of the border. If they should ask me about S3, I’ll have to tell a little white lie (remember Forrest Gump’s mother said they don’t hurt anybody after all) and tell them that there were only two seasons.

      • atcdave says:

        In a related vein, I just had another “casual viewers” encounter tonight (with my in-laws). They were viewers in the first two seasons; while making dinner conversation my wife asked if they had watched Chuck this year, they said “we watched the season premier, but it was depressing so we haven’t watched since.” I couldn’t, in good conscience, say anything except, “yeah, it was.” We then discussed Burn Notice.

        As I’ve said, when the season gets better (maybe 3.09), I will happily start plugging it again; until then, I won’t have people associate my name with the show.

      • Rick Holy says:

        Ditto that thought, Dave. The sad, sad part is that THIS was THE SEASON with all the hype and the “base” all excited that we kept promoting and amost shoving the show down friends’ throats to get them to tune into this show that most of them never heard of. Now I’m almost embarrassed that I’ve been such a realy “fanatic.” If ep. 8 turns out to what they say it will be, it will go from embarrassment to humiliation.

        Yeesh. And it COULD HAVE BEEN so much better. Sad. Really & truly sad.

  36. Faith says:

    On the contrary I think ratings for the Fake Name are gonna skyrocket. Not like 11 million viewers or anything but there is always a bump with post-olympic coverage and this time shouldn’t be any different. Unfortunately for us the epi that the rest of the casual viewers will be checking out is one that will ruin their tastebuds of Chuck for life.

    Don’t buy into the hype that the casual viewer likes angst, they don’t. Unless you’re talking teenagers in which case they’re going after the wrong demographic (18-49).

    • weaselone says:

      JS, CF and the Chuck fans kind of remind me of the Vizzini and Imigo Montoya in the Princess Bride. Each time Wesley thwarts one of Vizzini’s plans he blurts out “Inconceivable.” Eventually, Imigo comments that the word doesn’t mean what he Vizzini seems to think it does.

      JS and CF are much like Vizzini this season. Each time they deliver something that just doesn’t quite work they say trust us, the season is going to be epic. Now that the show has reached midway in the original season, there is a grwoing chorus of fans beginning to question whether they actually know the difference between an epic story and a tween drama.

      • weaselone says:

        …and whether I am capable of correctly spelling words and utilizing proper grammar in my posts.

      • Faith says:

        lol I get my share of typos and grammar errors. It’s all right.

        “My name is Inigo Montoya, and you killed my father” 😀

      • atcdave says:

        Awesome comparison; I can just see JS sputtering “inconceivable!”

      • Faith says:

        lol this is what happens when you’re in a hurry…

        “My name is Inigo Montoya, and you killed my father,” 😀 “My name is Inigo Montoya and you killed my father”

        Said the fans to Josh Shwartz and company LOL.

      • weaselone says:

        Well, JS and CF should probably be careful lest some of the crazy shippers have an overdeveloped sense of vengeance.

      • atcdave says:

        Yes, Faith is politely not using the last part of that line!

  37. Waverly says:

    Pardon my ignorance, but what exactly is the “Sarah rule”?

    • joe says:

      It’s a form of television censorship, Waverly.
      We’ll not obviously be told anything positive, definite about Sarah’s sex life.

      Inferences will be made, however.

      • Waverly says:

        Thanks. Or, since everyone knows about broadcast decency laws in the US, do you really mean story-telling censorship?

        It’s interesting that that rule doesn’t apply to Chuck.

      • joe says:

        Yeah, it’s not the law, nor the network’s doing. It doesn’t get that far. It’s built into the story-telling.

  38. eaglemmoomin says:

    No pain no gain is my attitude. The TPTB have built up a set of rules and reasons why Chuck and Sarah can’t be together. If it requires several episodes to remove those objections and reservations with some missteps for the characters to realise that they can’t go back no matter how hard they try then it is what it is. I know the awesome is coming and I’m mostly happy with the journey so far, sure they are trying to pack a lot in and certain things would work better with more time, but short of Sarah macking on Papa B while Chuck is trapped in a burning building I’ll be ok.

  39. RC says:

    Love this comment. lol

    Magnus Anton Lekay said…

    I recommend watching episode 8 as if it were in some alternate universe. We return to that universe, more or less, in 9 and on. 🙂 I do think people will enjoy 8 on some level… but not shippers.

    So the Sarah scenes are like deleted scenes or maybe the whole episode is. I think the punch is going to do more damage to their realtionship. She will run to Shaw and the Name reveal will be to him. All these things that we want to see happen between Chuck and Sarah intimacy wise will happen with Sarah and Shaw. It is time for Sarah to pull a Chuck and be so invested in her new man that she forgets Chuck exists.

    All the above will be piss me off. So taking the night off. I will be reading your blog for fan reaction though. I am going to watch 3.08 sometime down the line as a standalone episode of Bizzarro Chuck. lol

  40. Stef62 says:

    I can feel a ‘Mauser’ moment coming on somewhere after 3.08. Where they’ll sweep all the damage done under some convient corner of the carpet.

    As for the end of s3…I can see JS pulling a ‘Marissa’ on the show

    • RC says:

      Who goes Casey, Morgan or Awesome. Certainly not Sarah or Chuck.

      • Stef62 says:

        They’ve already stated that they can’t keep going to the ‘will they, won’t they’ angst well.

        So if they’re unwilling to write a show with a stable loving relationship between the 2 leads at the center of that show. Then the easiest route for them to follow is to kill off 1 of them.

        They wouldn’t kill off the titular character, so logically that would leave Sarah, because if you leave them alive but apart, the temptation remains to put them back together.

        Plus they get a nice new revenge angst strand for Chuck.

  41. Gord says:

    I like to make my own mind up about an episode.

    One thing I recall about DR’s comments is he often likes to bait the shippers so I’m never quite sure when to take him seriously.

    If it does turn out to be really bad, well at least from all accounts 3.09 is going to be a really great episode. Hopefully it will make up for any shortcomings.

    It is interesting that this is an Ali Adler episode and her episodes usually make shippers gush. If it does end up being a very bad episode it will probably destroy her credibility with the fans and that would be unfortunate.

    If DR is correct with this assessment, the only reason I could see the episode being written this way would be to set up for something really big happening in a later episode.

    • atcdave says:

      I know 3.09 should start the climb back out of the pit; we’ve known for a long time that the season would end in a good place. But to me, the biggest question all along has been, how much damage will be done to the characters? I’m realizing, the characters actually matter more to me than the story itself. So my concern about what we’re hearing is great. As they say, its the journey, not the destination. 3.08 will determine if the journey is worth it. Funny how, as the journey gets rougher, they’re now trying to calm us down with talk of the destination. Total fubar.
      I know I need to make my own decision about the episode. Its just the consequenses could be big to me. I have NEVER, been as disappointed with a TV show as I have been this season. A good resolution already matters less to me than it did at the start of the season, its not impossible they could cross that threshold where the reward is no longer worth the grief.

      • Fake Empire says:

        Hey guys, you’re both right in allowing our own opinions to be shaped by the episode itself. When I first read the news that something “insanely offensive to the Sarah character” would occur, that seriously got me riled up. I agree Dave, the characters are extremely important to me too, particularly Sarah as she is incredibly complex and simply fun to analyze. Frankly, Sarah is also easy to root for. So, obviously I am concerned over any potential upcoming harm to her character in 3.08. Yeah, it is good to form our own assessments after the epi, but I am glad for the “warning shot” that was fired. I can now go stock up on anti-nausea meds for the inevitable stomach discomfort. 😉

        Has this season been anything like what you expected or hoped for? I gotta say: not for me. But, I hold on with hope.

      • Lucian says:

        Based on what they’ve said, I would guess that 3.8 involves
        – Sarah attempting and failing to make the relationship with Danny only professional (nothing new here)

        – Sarah reveals her real name to Danny.

        To those suggesting this is wildly inconsistent with Sarah’s character; that is the point – over the course of the last several episodes she is becoming much more emotionally open. Her name reveal to Danny indicates that she really is a different character than the one we thought we knew.

        Carmichael, on the other hand, deals with all of this by decking Danny – not the response we saw in Beefcake from Chuck the man-child. Now, he can be the bully. Now he is an adolescent that can punch. By 3.10, we get to college-age Carmichael.

      • weaselone says:

        Except it would appear that Sarah chooses to become emotionally open with Danny who she just met and shouldn’t really trust as opposed to I don’t know, Casey, Ellie or even the source of her emotional turmoil, Chuck.

      • Lucian says:

        Weaselone – but, of course, that would not:
        1) provide the necessary angst we love so much
        2) allow us to all get a good view of Danny’s large pecs, which is why he was brought in in the first place (obviously not because of his acting ability).

      • Anonymous says:

        Lucian-
        But isn’t there a difference between a “professional” relationship, a “romantic” relationship and friendship. What develops between Shaw and Sarah is friendship, not romance. And the punch out scene might be after Chuck discovers Hannah is a Shaw plant. And the “betrayal” is Sarah taking Shaw’s side in front of Chuck. Then she kisses him for teaching Chuck a lesson he needs to learn…

      • Lucian says:

        Anonymous – I’m purely speculating regarding what Sarah could do which would be so terrible (based on the comments from the Chuckgasmic web site). It is clearly the case they are showing us that Sarah is not as emotionally constipated as she once was. There are so many ways they could have done so many things better this season, IMO. But, it is their show. I have two options:
        1) watch or not watch
        2) buy or not buy Footlongs

        I’m still watching, because it is still one of the better shows on tv (it used to be, IMO clearly the best).

      • weaselone says:

        You wouldn’t punish Subway for the failure of the show to deliver, would you? 🙂

      • SWnerd says:

        I would never punish Subway. I find their product implementation amusing. Plus I can always count on them to deliver some tasty sandwiches. They have my complete trust (unlike certain others who shall remain nameless).

  42. Jen says:

    Just saw this on Twitter:
    MattMtvguy Whoa – “Chuck Versus The Beard” is far and away one of THE best #CHUCK episodes ever. @joshschwartz76 @zacharylevi

    Could that thought carry us through 3.08?

  43. Lucian says:

    Here’s the real indictment of season 3 from my perspective; how many Subway footlongs have I purchased since Pink Slip? The answer would be 0. And, I’ll continue my boycot until they tell a story I find entertaining. I’ll watch, but I’m not buying….

    • SWnerd says:

      But it’s not Subway’s fault. They have no say in creative direction. I’m sure when they made that deal, they didn’t know TPTB were going to turn the fanbase against themselves. I mean who would ever think that?

      • atcdave says:

        Actually, I think Subway is one of the players who could ensure this never happens again. Any “artistic” endeavor must answer to its sponsors. Our feedback is indirect because we can only respond as the episodes air; or as spoilers come available. But if Subway is spending money on sponsorship, they SHOULD make sure the product is one they want to be associated with; specifically, keep those fans who are buying subs happy! If TPTB don’t like that arrangement they never should have accepted the sponsors money. As I’ve said before, a professional artist who can’t deal with the pressures of pleasing sponsors, becomes an amateur.

      • Lucian says:

        I’m not blaming Subway. The issue is, I’m not going to go out of my way on Monday after work for a show that is only moderately good. They have to be better than they are right now for me to do more than I would do for any other tv show. That is, of course, just me.

      • SWnerd says:

        Yeah I can understand that. I guess I just consider the fans and Subway on the same team. I mean we did work together to save the show after all. Plus I just really love Subway. If TPTB don’t mind pissing off the fans, they probably don’t mind pissing off the sponsors. They only care about telling their story no matter what anyone else does. Based on that and their reactions to our reactions, they just strike me as being really stubborn and defiant.

      • Lucian says:

        I can say with a high level of confidence that Subway cares about 1 thing with respect to Chuck – how many footlongs are sold. The characters, the story are far more important to us than to them. If they were in charge of the show, we would probably see a weekly catfight between Sarah and Ellie in t-shirts in the fountain.

      • atcdave says:

        Just to be clear, I’m not blaming Subway for anything. I see them as an ally in this. But I think idealy, they should be a focal for pressure on TPTB. I know it wouldn’t be anything too heavy handed; but they can’t be happy that many fans are grumbling, or as Lucian says, “not going out of my way on Monday after work for a show that is only moderately good.”

  44. Jason says:

    the problem with the Sarah character, is she has noone in this show except chuck to talk to, and sarah seems to try to communicate with chuck telepathically, and poor chucks brain doesn’t have room to process the messages she sends. In future episodes, they either need to introduce another character for her, or open up her and ellie for some reason (my hope always was ellie would find out, but sarah and ellie would keep it from the boys for some lame reason, my guess is the two ladies would be wonderful at this, really open up some fun) Anyhow, it seems like shaw is going to serve that role for the next episode or two or five, depending on how much TPTB want to torment me?

  45. Jason says:

    by the way, has anyone ever given the notion that ellie may be able to intersect? Much like star wars,the force was with father, son and a somewhat latent daughter??

  46. lou federico says:

    it is always darkest before the sunrise. Everybody hold hands and sing “WE SHALL OVERCOME!!” You can not always have joy without disapointment. The more disapointment the better the joy will be. Shrink out!!

    • joe says:

      Oh, gee.

      I hope we aren’t becoming a false-religion here, complete with weekly benedictions (Mondays at 8), music, readings and sermons like I’ve been giving, breaking of bread (Subway footlongs) heresies and sins and now redemption – QUICK! STOP ME BEFORE I TAKE THIS ANALOGY TOO FAR!!!

      • Rick Holy says:

        You already have, Joe! 😉

        But as long as we’re “going for broke” with that analogy, if the show continues as it’s going (and gets even WORSE as has been alluded to re: episode 8), then the show DESERVES to be crucified!

        There. I said it.

      • joe says:

        Knew I’d get your attention with that, Fr. Rick. 😉

      • Ernie Davis says:

        So the show must die for the sins of TPTB.

      • Lucian says:

        Easter Monday is 5 weeks from now – puts them at episode 12. I didn’t realize they were planning the season to relate to the Church’s calendar. I guess TPTB are more intelligent than I am giving them credit for! 🙂

      • Ernie Davis says:

        We’re all going to hell…

      • joe says:

        [And now Ernie is running around carrying a sign that says “REPENT!”] 😛

      • Ernie Davis says:

        And when I read that I actually did LOL.

        I do have a substantial beard and some comfortable sandals oddly enough.

      • Rick Holy says:

        Ernie – but I also believe in RESURRERCTION!! At the rate we’re going, the show DOES deserve to be crucified – but there’s ALWAYS hope of resurrection – and that depends on TPTB – not me. I don’t write the episodes, I only suffer through them.

  47. Stef62 says:

    There’s an article in SFX magazine about Chuck, that includes an interview with CF. In it he says that, (and i’m paraphrasing here on the way he says it. but not the content), that Chuck has the potential to be James Bond, he just doesn’t know it yet.

    • weaselone says:

      Who’d want Chuck to be James Bond? The man has a different woman or five every movie.

      • SWnerd says:

        If he’s not sleeping with them, he’s slapping them. Or they get killed. Or all three. Bond is kind of a douche.

      • Ernie Davis says:

        Uhm, there is already a James Bond spy, named James Bond, or Cole or Bryce, or even Roan (although Roan is clearly superior, his martinis include gin). I want to see Chuck as Chuck, playing Bond (or Carmichael), not bond.

      • Waverly says:

        To be fair, the latest James Bonds have not been as neolithic as those from the first three decades.

    • Jason says:

      what was the old robert wagner show, hart to hart, funny, TPTB see it as james bond, I wonder what % of the fan base wish the vision was something of a equally paired spy couple?????

      • atcdave says:

        My first choice for a pattern would be Thin Man; but Hart to Hart, or Undercover Blues would be good choices.

        Bond, not so much.

      • joe says:

        I’ll second that notion about The Thin Man, Dave. Wonderful series. Gets better with age, too.

    • John says:

      Chuck turning into James Bond would be zzz…It would make him into another Bryce or Cole.

  48. Jason says:

    my mind right now is to wait to watch it until I hit the forums for a few minutes after the show ends to get a flavor for how bizarro Chuck Sarah played with the shippers, then fast forward thru the SS scenes the moment I spot trouble, maybe watch it complete later in the week.

  49. lou federico says:

    Big Day for all Chuckster!!!! House is a rerun coming off “The games” I hope for at least a 3.1 but would be happy with a 2.8. It is a bad time to have “bad” episode of Chuck. Crossing our fingers and hoping Father Rick has some “inside” pull.

    • JC says:

      Season finale of the Bachelor
      Carrie Underwood on HIMYM
      Olympic hiatus

      I’d be ecstatic if we pulled a 2.4. Maybe the House rerun will help.

      • John says:

        I’d wouldn’t be surprised to see another 2.2. Tough competition, obviously the Olympic hiatus (and lack of promo time), loss of shippers, and the fact that fake name isn’t exactly the best episode for new prospective viewers.

      • lou federico says:

        Forgot about the Damn Bachelor!!! You are right a 2.4 would be great. It needs to stay right around 2.4 for it to be safe.

      • atcdave says:

        I really not optimistic for tonight. With almost no advertising during the Olympics, no national media buzz, and a sour episode last time; I’d be surprised by anything over a 2.0. As far as our own media blitz goes, I think as soon as this episode is over we need to start pushing all of our networking contacts hard. Anyone who has ever been interested in Chuck needs to know things will get good starting at 3.09.

        Assuming things actually do get good then, we should see a steady climb towards the finale. I’m sort of glad to be getting no buzz right now. From what we’ve heard about this episode, I’m thinking any first time viewers tonight may be last time viewers.

    • Rick Holy says:

      When it comes to this stuff, I’d have more “pull” if I had a Nielsen box. A 3.1 would – imho – HAVE to be a result of “Divine Intervention.”

      The Bachelor (more [non]reality crap) is popular – I think HOUSE people will turn to it. And Carrie Underwood is on HIMYM?? I hadn’t heard that, but it sure aint gonna help us any.

      I’d be thrilled if we got back up to our season average (2.4/2.5) – but I’m not overly confident right now.

  50. JC says:

    So I’m listening to Mo Ryan on Chuck vs Podcast. And she let it slip that more than one fake name will be revealed tonight.

  51. lizjames says:

    Another thing worth watching tonight (besides what Sarah DOESN’T say) is what they include in the promo for next week’s episode or a promo for following weeks. I think TPTB are REALLY frightened by the reaction to Mask and if Fake Name is a TOTAL Chuck-Sarah downer (which I frankly don’t expect because it hasn’t been Adler’s style to day), they may run an upbeat promo. I don’t expect any reveals, but I would expect some positive stuff if the episode is very brutal.

    • atcdave says:

      Yeah, I would expect a lot more publicity this week, starting with a good preview. It is interesting that the promo for 3.08 was pulled after 3.07 aired; especially after the voice-over indicated a preview was coming. I would LOVE to know when NBC decided they had a problem and couldn’t run the spot they had prepared. I just mean, I wonder if anyone was sharp enough to figure it out ahead of time (I doubt it because of the voice over); or if they were in panic mode reading responses on the forum, and someone made a snap decision in the control room. I’m sure we’ll never know.

  52. Mike B says:

    Joe, 3 hours to go here on the east coast. Where should we post our reactions?

  53. Jen says:

    T-8min here in Miami n I’m not home yet!

    Make the best of the ep y’all! And if it sucks that much, consider it a “glitch in the matrix”!

    😉

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