Part III
And we thank you for all your input!
5.07 – Chuck vs. The Santa Suit
Writer: Amanda Kate Shuman
Director: Peter Lauer
Guest Stars: Rebecca Romijn, Brandon Routh, Stan Lee
Synopsis: From Spoiler TV:
Chuck and Sarah learn who is trying to destroy Carmichael Industries; Ellie’s Christmas plans come undone; a computer virus threatens to ruin Christmas at Buy More.
Spoilers: This will be a Christmas episode!
http://twitter.com/#!/MarkChrLawrence/status/118807733381251073
(click on pic to make it bigger)
TVline:
Question: Do you have any spoilers on Chuck? —Nick
Ausiello: In the Christmas episode “Chuck vs. The Santa Suit” (airing Dec. 23), both Chuck and Sarah find themselves on the receiving end of big ol’ smooches from other people — and one of the people delivering a kiss is most definitely not a friendly.
Got any scoop on the holiday episode of Chuck? — Henry
NATALIE: ‘Tis the season for mistletoe, and boy, will there be a lot of smooching going on! Not only will Chuck kiss another woman, but Sarah will kiss another man. But that won’t be the biggest secret that she’s hiding from her hubby. There’s another that will change the dynamic of their relationship forever.
5.08 – Chuck vs. The Baby
Writers: Rafe Judkins & Lauren LeFranc
Director: Matt Barber
Guest Stars: Cheryl Ladd, Tim Dekay
Synopsis:
Spoilers:
10-2011: TVLine
Former Charlie’s Angels sleuth Cheryl Ladd has been tapped to play the mother of Yvonne Strahovski’s Sarah on Chuck — and TVLine readers can (maybe) take credit for the casting!
Last week, TVLine suggested five actresses for the plum part, one of whom was Ladd. And when all the votes in the accompanying poll were counted, the 60-year-old actress won with nearly 27 percent.
Well done, my friends. Well. Done.
Look for Sarah’s estranged mum, Emma, to turn up in this season’s eighth episode, slated to air in January. I’m told mother and daughter share a very complicated past and haven’t seen each other in five years.
Something tells me we’re about to find out why.
Promos:
5.09 – Chuck vs. the Kept Man
Writers: Craig Digregorio, Phil Klemmer
Director: Fred Toye
Guest Stars: Carrie-Anne Moss, Omar Dorsey, Marco Rodreguiz, Jim Tavare
Synopsis:
“CHUCK VERSUS THE KEPT MAN”
01/06/2012 (08:00PM – 09:00PM) (Friday) : GERTRUDE VERBANSKI RETURNS WITH A MISSION FOR CHUCK AND A PROPOSITION FOR CASEY — CARRIE-ANNE MOSS GUEST STARS — While Chuck (Zachary Levi) and Sarah (Yvonne Strahovski) contemplate the next step for Carmichael Industries, Casey’s (Adam Baldwin) forbidden love, Gertrude Verbanski (guest star Carrie-Anne Moss, “The Matrix”), walks back into his life with a questionable mission in South Beach. Meanwhile, Jeff’s (Scott Krinsky) enhanced intelligence leads he and Lester (Vik Sahay) to suspect that something unusual may be happening at the Buy More. Joshua Gomez, Ryan McPartlin and Mark Christopher Lawrence also star.
Promo: Thanks to Spoiler TV:
Spoilers:
Narrator: “As for Chuck and Sarah…”
Chuck: [staring at a ‘stick’] “Changing… it’s changing… changing… What is it? An equal sign? An Arrow? …”
5.10 – Chuck vs. Bo
Writers:
Director:
Guest Stars: Angus Macfadyen, Bo Derek
Synopsis:
From ChuckTV.net and SpoilerTV:
Chuck and Sarah must go to Vail on one last mission, where they get some help from Bo Derek; Jeff and Lester continue their mission.
Spoilers:
10-2011: TVLine:
Macfadyen’s arc (as a villain) will span the last four episodes of Chuck‘s fifth and final season
5.11 – Chuck vs. The Bullet Train
Writers:
Director:
Guest Stars: Angus Macfadyen
Synopsis: From TV Edge:
A MISSION ABOARD A JAPANESE BULLET TRAIN SPIRALS OUT OF CONTROL, PUTTING THOSE CLOSEST TO CARMICHAEL INDUSTRIES IN DANGER – ANGUS MACFADYEN GUEST STARS — When a mission in Japan becomes a hostage situation, Sarah (Yvonne Strahovski) and Chuck (Zachary Levi) must face the merciless Nicholas Quinn (guest star Angus Macfadyen, “Braveheart”) aboard a speeding Japanese bullet train. Meanwhile, the mission leaves Casey with an impossible decision. Joshua Gomez, Sarah Lancaster, Ryan McPartlin, Scott Krinsky, Vik Sahay and Mark Christopher Lawrence.
Spoilers:
Promo:
5.12 – Chuck vs. Sarah
Writers: Rafe Judkins & Lauren LeFranc
Director:
Guest Stars: Angus Macfadyen
Synopsis: From Spoiler TV:
01/27/2012 (08:00PM – 09:00PM) (Friday) : SARAH MUST KEEP A SECRET FROM CHUCK IN ORDER TO ACCOMPLISH A MISSION — ANGUS MACFADYEN GUEST STARS AS ‘NICHOLAS QUINN’ — After a harrowing mission, Sarah (Yvonne Strahovski) returns to Chuck (Zachary Levi) with a huge secret. Meanwhile, Ellie (Sarah Lancaster) and Awesome (Ryan McPartlin) are presented with a new opportunity that could change their lives. Adam Baldwin and Joshua Gomez also star.
Spoilers:
5.13 – Chuck vs. The Goodbye
Writers: Chris Fedak
Director: Robert Duncan McNeil
Guest Stars: Linda Hamilton, Mekenna Melvin, Angus Macfadyen
Synopsis: From Spoiler TV:
01/27/2012 (09:00PM – 10:00PM) (Friday) : CHUCK’S FINAL MISSION BRINGS HIM BACK TO HIS ROOTS AS HE FIGHTS TO SAVE HIS FUTURE – ANGUS MACFADYEN AND LINDA HAMILTON GUEST STAR — Chuck (Zachary Levi) enlists his family, friend and some unexpected allies as he races to stop Nicholas Quinn (guest star Angus Macfadyen, “Braveheart”) from destroying everything Chuck has built over the past five years. Yvonne Strahovski, Joshua Gomez, Adam Baldwin, Sarah Lancaster, Scott Krinsky, Vik Sahay and Mark Christopher Lawrence also star.
Spoilers:
amyabn
atcDave
Ernie Davis
Faith
joe
thinkling
Chuck This 
Continued from the previous spoiler discussion…
Thanks, that last page was a pig to load.
Don’t you just hate it when that happens? 😉
The hard part is to link back to all the *passion* in the discussions. That’s not something the Intertubes do well, yet.
Here, I’ll try to get some of the passion back. 😉
Sh ……. Sh …….. Sh …….. Nope, sorry can’t do it.
Good try, though, Shep. I’ll give you this much. You know where the buttons are.
😉
Only on a Chuck blog do the readers know that the four-letter curse word that starts with ‘Sh’ ends with ‘w’, not ‘t’.
Yeah the previous thread often crashed my iPad!
You know – I was actually just stopping by to plead for someone to start a new thread!
My computer froze twice this afternoon when I tried to stop by…..
You guys must be mind readers? Or Intersected!!!
We were going for a record…
Here is a 34 second snipet from 5×7, answers the question what do Chuck, Stan Lee and General Beckman have in common?
If you guessed they share a kiss, you got it wrong, or maybe you just plain and simple are wrong, or maybe have something wrong with you, can’t stop typing, I think I am suffering from some verbosity malady?
http://insidetv.ew.com/2011/12/21/chuck-stan-lee/
Video sneaks from 5.07
http://multipleverses.com/2011/12/21/chuck-episode-5-07-chuck-vs-the-santa-suit-3-sneak-peeks-plus-promo-photo-with-brandon-routh-as-agent-shaw/
Synopsis for 510:
“Season 5, Episode 10 “Chuck Versus Bo”
MORGAN FACES THE CONSEQUENCES OF HIS TIME AS THE INTERSECT WHEN HE MUST PIECE TOGETHER A LOST WEEKEND IN VAIL — BO DEREK (“10″) AND ANGUS MACFADYEN (“BRAVEHEART”) GUEST STAR — As Chuck (Zachary Levi) and Sarah (Yvonne Strahovski) try to realize a new, safer future, Morgan’s (Joshua Gomez) past as the Intersect sends them to Vail on one last mission, where they enlist the help of an unlikely source — the legendary Bo Derek (as herself). Elsewhere, Jeff (Scott Krinsky) and Lester (Vik Sahay) continue their own spy mission. Adam Baldwin, Sarah Lancaster and Mark Christopher Lawrence also star.”
I must admit that the premise surprised me. A lost weekend? When?
But, Jeff and Lester playing spies sounds like it could be fun. Only three episodes after this one.
Are Chuck and Sarah going to inherit someone else’s baby somehow from the baby episode (cause if SArah had a kid, the kid would be at least 6 or 7, not a baby)? Will that be the reason they quit the spy life, or go on that one last mission? Will they lose that baby somehow as the tragedy they face toward the season end, hence they decide to start a family of their own?
I think they’ve been laying the groundwork in the last few episodes for Chuck and Sarah to want to settle down. The mortal danger that is supposed to occur in the next episode (Santa Suit) may be enough to nudge them even further in that direction.
I do not think that Sarah and Chuck will be inheriting someone else’s baby. I could see them talking seriously about having children, though, by the time this episode rolls around.
Yeah DKD, I think Chuck and Sarah talking family, especially after this week’s mortal peril may what spurs the decision. Although I think there still an outside chance Thinkling’s idea of a pregnancy/miscarriage may be the big drama that triggers the need to retire.
Either way, I like that it’s being discussed.
I have given a lot of thought to Thinkling’s miscarriage speculation and I think it is possible. The question I have is when it would happen, if it does happen.
Something happens that causes Chuck and Sarah to go from “one final mission” in 410 to their spy life continuing through the end of the season. Maybe the last four episodes are one big mission that occurs in a limited timeframe.
If a miscarriage is in there somewhere, I would bet later(411?) rather than sooner.
…and then there is the secret, which I think I know what it is, but no one else here has guessed.
If I’m right, it will throw a whole new spin on EVERYTHING. Everyone’s spec will be thrown off.
DKD, well lets hear it!
Yeah, do tell DKD
I’m tempted, but I won’t. If it was something I actually speculated, I would. But, it’s something where someone let something slip and I came to a certain conclusion from it. That makes it a quasi-spoiler-speculation rather than pure speculation.
There’s still a small possibility that I concluded the wrong thing, but if I got it right I don’t want to ruin the surprise for anyone.
DKD – sounds like that secret is not exactly part of the ‘love letter’ to the fans? Matter of fact, the ‘love letter’ is more and more starting to sound like a short ‘tweet’ to the fans, in the last 5 minutes of the 13th ep?
Jason…my take on the love letter that has been tossed around is this. it is for all fans not just a certain segment. from the big perspective morgan got a larger role in the first three while he had the intersect, casey got a love life sort of, jeff and lester got a decent plot that has been constant and appears they have a big role coming up, ellie and devon also seem to be heading toward their moment. buy more actually seems to have purpose again. it’s what fans have been asking for for a while. there are some fans as well that like relationship drama or angst, that looks to be coming soon.
i do understand that some segments maybe getting less than they want this year just the same as some people are getting to much of what they don’t.
all in all it looks like they are trying to give each segment of the fan base a little something before they go. isn’t that what a love letter to the fans should be, one that includes something for all the fans?
Army – troll someone else’s posts.
You need to take a moment and watch this video from the set of Chuck : final wrap for the cast
I’ve watched it several times already……another reason why we love this show [ warts & all]
I do believe that’s Zac proving it’s alright for men (and stars!) to cry.
Wow.
Added: I just realized that TheSdub07 asked that credit be given to them for the video. So, all credit! Please click on the YouTube button on the video above, go there, and if you have a moment, leave a message of appreciation.
Yes – Thanks Joe…. she did post it on Twitter
@ SDub07 – and she would probably appreciate hearing from you directly too : )
If yall are Twitterers – she’s certainly a wonderful person to follow ~ just say’n.
Also – there are some early photos for Chuck vs. the baby: [ not really spoilers though] http://www.spoilertv.co.uk/images/chuck/season-5/promotional-episode-photos/Episode%205.08%20-%20Chuck%20Versus%20The%20Baby/preview+%283%29.jpg.php
Wow. So, so sad.
Did someone throw salt in Yvonne’s eyes just b4 the video started, she looks abnormally upset doesn’t she? Interesting how quickly she could turn that smile and curtsy on when introduced, then back to bawling her eyes out? None of the guys around her even looked concerned, I wonder if that had been going on for a while?
She had a hanky, so I’m thinking she was in weepy mode the whole time and swallowed it back to take her bow. It was an understandably emotional, weepy time … for everyone. Ahh, they were probably just jealous that she got the hanky 😉
I think Fedak had commented on that a few days ago that Yvonne was a weepy mess the whole last week.
I don’t know what I’ll think if the use Shaw to reveal something from Sarah past – again.
Moo-hah-hah?
Seriously, I think we would be focussing more on the message than the messenger.
without any info on the message, seems pointless. seems like it is something lame the writers made up to drum up drama, since they are incapable of writing a story in the present that is compelling?
Jason, the last line of the episode was spoiled then pulled. i know what it is and it is not throw away line.
ARmy I never said it was a throw away line, what I implied is it was something that was not shown on tv, something made up about the past which will cause fans to react. As opposed to a story told ON TV to touch one’s emotions, which is what great story tellers do.
I’m bracing myself for tonight, not that I think it’s going to be bad. I expect a well resolved story and a satisfying episode. Somebody, in an interview, said Santa Suit could be a good finale for all the characters, so I think it will end in a pretty good place. But I have a feeling that Shaw will mention the secret, and Chuck and Sarah won’t talk about it until next week. I bet some CGP that it will be ambiguous enough that there will be much speculation and gnashing of fan-teeth. I also think it won’t be as bad as people think it will. I’m expecting a week like the one between AoT and First Fight … with unwarranted fan-angst and a similarly satisfying episode in 5.08
I could get it wrong all the way around, but I’m in the glass half full camp 😉
Jason, yeah i got that. throw away line was the best i can do. it will make sense when you see the episode.
i like your point about the past. it seems like they have that planned for 5.08. they say it will make people see sarah as a different character. which to me sounds exactly like you just said. if they do change her past that much i wonder what the fans reactions will be?
For the record, I don’t think TPTB want to tank their own show or intentionally create ill will among fans. By now, I think they know at least a couple of things that would do that: creating a rift between Chuck and Sarah or damaging Sarah. Seeing her as a different character can mean a lot of things, not all of them bad. If they said that for Sarah Walker fans, this would be their favorite all time episode, then I can’t believe they are going to ruin her character. I think they finally get the Sarah love.
The usual disclaimer applies, but that’s my gut feeling.
I think its going to be the most exciting development we’ve seen in a long time.
It’s going to make this show interesting and worth talking about again. Pretty much every critic I respect has said it is great.
That being said, there may very well be some fans who despise it. Look at Homeland. It’s on almost every critic’s year-end top 10 list and there are people who hated the season finale.
Thinkling…exactly. maybe her past was not as bad as people have been led to believe? suppose it was pretty good after all.
As much as I’m looking forward to the episode in general, I’m REALLY looking forward to the fan reaction to the cliffhanger. I predict the Chuck twitter feeds will explode.
And be hilariously funny. I can’t wait to see people lose their damn minds. 🙂
Thought that I’d just drop this off for the rest of the week – then we can get rid of it later….
Hmmm – lots to consider – and there’s probably not much point in speculation other than Shaw has sent someone [ Sarah’s old handler] to kill a young child that now lives with Sarah’s mother….
Looking forward to finding out much more about her past.
I’m sure we’ll have lots more to discuss after this episode ~ just say’n.
Wow! I could not have imagined DeKay in that kind of role! I’m looking forward to that one.
Thanks for the link, Gringo. I’ll be putting it up-top in a little bit.
The men from Sarah’s ‘past’ have been a little hard on her lately, looks like she is going to be knocked about a little bit more this ep, but I doubt it will be in a perverted way such as the last ep. Maybe Bryce can come back in 5×9 and slap her around a little, just to keep those stakes raised.
Shaw’s plan set in motion was probably to tell Ryker? So Ryker has a vendetta against the baby and wants to kill her, or is it something else about the now young girl that interests the big baddie’s?
Did everyone notice the ‘red door’ and ‘white picket fences’ from Sarah’s mom’s house?
I think somehow the child’s mere existence threatens someone. The obvious thing being like royalty which would have a claim to power that a new regime would not like. Perhaps its an organized crime equivalent of this or some such???
Well, keep beating that dead horse till its bones are dust. There was nothing perverse about Santa Suit, Jason. It is good to remember that Sarah is a spy who has killed countless people by shooting them, poisoning them, blowing them up real good, etc. It is a dangerous profession. She knows the risks of being captured and tortured by her enemies, as in fact she has counseled Chuck many times. Also, evil doers such as Shaw have no moral code and harm men, women, children, furry little animals, etc. What is different about Shaw and the Joker, Lex Luthor, Green Goblin, Mandarin, Red Skull, etc. They hurt their enemies. This is happens in stories that have heroes and villains. Don’t forget Darth Vader tortured Princess Leia and Jabba the Hutt(well let’s not go there, ugh)
Also, you comment that Fedak hates the Sarah character seems strange because by that logic Joss Whedon must have loathed Buffy Summers given all of the horrors he put her through in seven seasons(mom dying, boyfriends torturing and trying to kill you, gods killing you, friends ripping you out of heaven, etc.) From all that I have read about writers, filmakers, creators in general, they are genuienly fond and love all of their characters even the villains. It might be good to realize that about Schwartz and Fedak. Also, they worked very hard to see that the show lasted for five seasons, so a little respect is in order.
@AndyT:
Apparently, something that Jason wrote has pushed one or more of your buttons, and you’ve decided to beat this particular horse to death. In doing so, be aware that you may be pushing other people’s buttons.
I haven’t seen this episode myself, but I have already heard from a number of people I know who have seen it, that they didn’t care for the physical abuse of Sarah either, so it isn’t just Jason. Keep in mind that Chuck runs at 8pm, primetime TV, and that means there are children watching. This isn’t the first time its happened; I know a couple of sets of parents who were upset when their children saw Daniel Shaw murder Stephen Bartowski in cold blood in front of his children, in episode 3.18.
A big part of the reason why this show lasted 5 seasons was the gift of time and attention given to it by its fans, in spite of a series of mistakes by the showrunners that effectively amputated part of that fanbase and traumatized some of the rest in Season 3. As you will notice when you read the comments here and on other sites, we have a rather twitchy fanbase, especially when it comes to Daniel Shaw. I have an MBA and have worked in sales end of different businesses for almost 40 years; I can tell you that anyone with any business sense could have avoided at least some of those mistakes. Broadcast TV IS a business, their business; they should have known better.
Then you demand that I respect Mr. Schwarz and Mr. Fedak; well, I have trouble respecting someone who cannot hide their contempt for me. That contempt for the audience was on full display during the Season 3 collapse.
And you wrote this:
“From all that I have read about writers, filmakers, creators in general, they are genuienly fond and love all of their characters even the villains.”
That sounds like something a journalist made up for an article, because I’m a writer, and in my experience, that is nonsense. A writer might be fond of some characters, but by and large they are just building blocks or brush strokes, that we use to build a story or paint a picture in words. If anything, the opposite is often true: when we craft a story, it’s too easy to get caught up in the crafter’s impersonal viewpoint of putting things together, and forget how a story will look from the audience’s personal point of view of the finished product.
Feel free to beat on my horse, if you like.
Andy – I do not like Fedak’s story telling style very much. I don’t like the character Shaw even a little bit, none. But, I hold no malice toward you or anyone who does. Other than the multiple, spiteful beatings Fedak and his boy Shaw laid on Sarah in 5×7, I liked the ep. A top 50 episode for sure, joining the ‘Other Guy’ as Shaw episodes that are not in MY bottom 15, I knows yours is different, that’s cool. I do understand why others liked the episode, but I did not.
If you have read other postings of mine over the past two years, none of this should be a surprise, I have been pretty consistent about my likes and dislikes for the show. I am sort of sick of the debate however, I have weathered some variation of this debate with what seems like near a dozen different bloggers, sometimes with the same author who just used different names. I am glad you enjoyed the ep, hope the season works out for both of us. I think it will.
I kind of hate to step back into this, I think there are two viewpoints here that are both more extreme than my own. I have some sympathy for both camps.
I do agree with Andy that bad guys do bad things, that’s what makes us revile them and root against them. By that measure I find Shaw a passable villain, but not at all fun in the way Volkoff or Roark were fun to me.
But I also agree with VV that we the viewers will likely have an emotional investment in the characters and show that is markedly different from the show runners and writers. My own experience with writing was in the area of game design (AD&D), and I know I often had intense attachment to characters and stories. But my attachment was often very different from the players (audience). I often loved and hated things in different measures. If I was going to keep my players happy (and keep eight or so guys showing up week after week) I had to respect THEIR taste, at least as much as my own. Sometimes it can be quite a balancing act to keep all parties engaged and happy with the story and characters. I think on Chuck we saw a major malfunction in that regard in S3; and TPTB have never managed to recapture the magic that brought so many different tastes together in S1 and S2. But S4 and S5 have clearly been a better show for those of us who despised S3. I wish they hadn’t brought back Shaw and all his associated baggage, because I didn’t ever need to see him again, and a majority of the more casual viewers I know feel the same way (although not nearly with the passion VV describes). Among my minor beefs with Santa Suit would be it was structurally the same as both Other Guy and Ring II (Shaw has a plan, captures Sarah, Chuck saves the day); I so wanted to see Sarah take down Shaw this time. And I think any number of other villains from the past would have been more satisfying for me to see again.
But in spite of being a bit repetitive (and a couple other minor complaints expressed elsewhere) Santa Suit was fun. It did a lot of the things Chuck has done well for five seasons (humor and action), and left me ready for more in the end. It will never be a top five or top ten episode for me; but a middle of the road Chuck episode is still one of the best things on TV.
I can’t say if TPTB hate Sarah or not ( Although I know which way I’m leaning), but of the two, they certainly love Shaw way more. The final scene of 5.07 proves that.
Dave, on the structurally the same part. TBH IMHO it’s been that way in more general terms the entire time. something happens to one character, it get’s worse, then saved by another character or the team. most of of the 3 ep arcs are like that, same with most of the longer ones and even some of the stand alones. it seems at times to me anyway, they try to take an episodic approach and spread it out over time.
i know i’m not saying it right so i’ll try to explain. castle is episodic for the most part. murder, find clues then catch the bad guy all in one ep. castle could do a 3 ep arc the sames as chuck does by doing the following. first ep they find dead guy and some small clues, fill i the rest with unrelated story lines of very minor characters, next ep more clues deeper danger more sub plots unrelated, final solve murder more sub plots.
i don’t follow chuck that close never did, but making a guess if you look at the 3 ep arc’s and just timed the main arc, it probably doesn’t go much past an hour total time, the rest would be filler, so to speak.
Army most shows follow a pattern of some sort or another. But there are elements that get mixed differently to keep things interesting. Chuck is generally very good at this, especially with the use of humor and a good cast of likeable characters. But even so, the Chuck vs Shaw formula strikes me as a bit repetitive. I mean, their big show down was even in the same setting the last two times!
As I’ve said, I don’t wish to make too big a thing of it. The episode was mostly fun and satisfying. But for a number of minor reasons it won’t be one of my favorites.
Dave if you noticed i didn’t comment on the ep. i saw it but refrain from opinion on it. the structure just caught my attention. i think it strikes more because it’s the same guy again in the same place. if it had been a different villain it would not have stuck out so bad, but that’s just a guess. if you look back it’s similar to when volkoff took it over by hacking in.
Everyone is assuming that DeKay’s reference to “her” is about the baby. It could be about Sarah’s mother.
Someone above said something about kids watching. Only 4% of the Chuck audience is Kids 2-11. The median age of the Chuck viewer is 50 now–well above the age to have little kids watching with them. Could we start treating this show like an adult show and not this mythical “family show” everyone thinks it is. It’s not.
Strangely I agree too about the 5 year old issue. But I would add, there is a huge ‘gap’ between the tastes in 20 something’s TV taste, and 50 something’s tastes. Had a long TV discussion with my son and his G/F over XMAS, we could not be more different in our POV’s, yet we watch lots of the same TV, just for different reasons. Makes for a strange bedfellows, when 50 somethings are part of your fervent fanbase, yet 20 / 30 somethings pay the bills with the way Nielson is set up, Chuck runs into that more than most because of the multi-genre style they try to adhere to.
Right dkd. Can’t confuse the hour the show airs with it’s content although that has restricted it in some ways. Well said VV, couldn’t agree more. Can’t wait for the Baby reveals.
FWI info for 5.08. ZL/YS quotes.
http://www.examiner.com/tv-insider-in-los-angeles/zachary-levi-yvonne-strahovski-preview-chuck-vs-the-baby
Funny the NBC synopsis talks about this episode causing big changes for Chuck and Sarah, but the interview completely refutes that. What a shock.
But I’m seriously excited by how good this episode looks!
well i don’t know if it goes that far. it could cause big changes for chuck and sarah as a couple and what they plan to do in the future but as zac says not affect the relationship. so it makes both of them true to a certain extent.
“…from a certain point of view…”
yeah i don’t remember the nbc one word for word. so it was more or less a guess.
Dave–
I just reread the official NBC synopsis and it doesn’t say anything about changes for Chuck and Sarah. Are you thinking of something else?
SARAH’S PAST COMES BACK TO HAUNT HER AND THREATENS THOSE CLOSEST TO HER — CHERYL LADD AND TIM DEKAY GUEST STAR — Sarah (Yvonne Strahovski) is forced to confront a secret from her past and feels she must do so alone, while Chuck (Zachary Levi) urges her to let him help. When Sarah encounters her original handler, Kieran Ryker (guest star Tim Dekay, “White Collar”), she fears that he will harm those closest to her, including her mom (guest star Cheryl Ladd, “Las Vegas”)
I can’t find the exact line now (perhaps it was in the short episode discription on my satelite service?). But it said “Sarah tries to keep a secret that will effect the dynamic of her relationship with Chuck forever”. Okay, even that’s a paraphrase because I can’t find it now!
It sounded like typical promotional hyperbole anyhow. But after reading those comments at TV Insider I really think its a load of doo-doo.
Nevermind, I found it, its on our own site! Its being quoted from TV Guide about the end of Santa Claus. Still, that seems to relate to Baby. And I still suspect its a load of doo-doo!
Zac seems to be a non shipper, his response about 5×8 seems to be ‘meh’.
Yvonne is the resident shipper on that cast , she seems to love the ep, doesn’t she?
Come on Dave! ya had me wondering about my post back to you and here ya had the wrong episode, yer killin me here LOL.
a new 56 sec promo from NBC on the baby.
http://www.nbc.com/chuck/video/secrets-and-lies/1375946
I have not been too worried about any real ugly, series ruining reveals in the 5×8 ep, nearly any worries posted about the ep have not bothered me at all. But after viewing this, I am even more excited … Sarah isn’t hiding everything, she is not sneaking away or anything. This appears to be nothing all that inappropriate for a married spy, ex world class assassin, she is packing up lots of guns and saying, I have a business trip ‘sweetie’ (cause she doesn’t use dear), see ya soon. I have not always been a Morgan fan, but ….. when TPTB let Morgan be Morgan, he is so awesome, his facial expression during the scene, priceless.
As a quirky side take, what if some of this is Sarah wanting to keep Chuck away from the big bad, rather than from her mom and the baby?
At the end of that promo, I really wanted a Burn Notice-style caption:
Sarah
The Client
Promo number 2 for 5.8 Chuck vs. the Baby
http://www.tvline.com/2011/12/chuck-season-5-episode-8-video-spoilers/
Which is probably the same video as recently posted above – just different link.
Still wondering if there would even be a Chuck and Sarah – if there wasn’t a Morgan in the mix.
Thanks! it is different than the above promo. kinda makes me wonder about all the claims that chuck doesn’t care about her past. the promo clearly shows he wants to know and is doing everything he can to find out, especially when morgan is the voice of reason.
It’s not that he doesn’t care, its that he loves her regardless. In that sense, it doesn’t matter. Of course he’d always like to know more about the woman he loves; especially when there might be something he can do to help her deal with old demons.
Yeah, I think that’s more it, Dave.
Game night in Castle? sounds good to me lol.
synopsis for 5.11 the bullet train.
New spoilers for The Baby are out from TVEdge:
I had a feeling that we were making some assumptions about when these things all occurred.
Joe – I don’t get it, what ‘assumptions’? Seems to me the blogs have been downright quiet about the so-called big baby uproar? IMO most think the episode is going to be awesome, after the woeful Shaw crap last week, well maybe luke warm Shaw crap. Are you reading something else?
Oh sure, Jason. There’s been speculation (if sometimes tacit) about that seconds-long scene that was promo’d last week with Emma, Sarah and the baby. The question was, when did that happen? Before C&S were married? Most assuredly. But how long before? Shaw era? Bryce era? Who’s baby? Was it even Sarah’s? I even saw the suggestion that the baby was Emma’s and another that the scene was a flashback from when Sarah first entered the CIA (and the baby was indeed hers).
Some specs didn’t fit any established time line (Shaw was dismissed rapidly by most, I think). That’s buried somewhere in pt. 2 of these spoiler threads, I’m pretty sure. Some comes from the black-hole of data, Twitter.
Joe this seems to me to be shipper haters trying to spew venom where there is none, they are mostly trolling their own sites with noone to play there silly blog games and turning on each other, like the vipers they are – LOL.
Take a look at these 5 pics from tonight if you dare. The cute girls always want to sit next to Morgan don’t they? Tonight is going to be epic!
http://zacharylevifan.com/gallery/displayimage.php?album=917&pid=59482#top_display_media
Joe, most of the ones i have read have the baby being rescued by sarah on a mission and she takes the baby to her mom or some variation of that theme. very few have the baby as hers. like i said it’s quite the opposite of that. DR made a very good point nobody has addressed. why is the baby so important? that poses an interesting question in itself.
I think it’ll come down to the baby being either from an asset she failed to protect (which could be why she was extra protective of Chuck – of course you could also put that down to her loving him) or it the child of one of Sarah’s assassination targets and she has to hide it away so it’s out of danger. Shaw finds this out and tells Ryker (who could be trying to tie up loose ends).
Chuck Season 5 episode titles: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0934814/episodes – well at least I think it should be accurate…. ~ just say’n
not sure about the last two. i thought they already released the finale as chuck vs the goodbye? and from what i have read elsewhere the title of 12 is still a big secret. but the titles listed do make sense.
IMDB frequently has inaccuracies. The worst was trying to figure out how many episodes Hannah and Shaw were in. The official synopsis for 5×11 (linked above) had the title as Chuck Versus the Bullet Train. The finale is supposed to be Chuck Versus the Goodbye. 5×12 could be “Last Mission” but I doubt it has “Part 1” in the title.
Yeah Jeff I’m pretty sure that’s just wrong.
Speculation can end about 5.12. Probably. The episode title is allegedly “Chuck vs. Sarah”.
http://chucktv.net/2011/12/31/spoilers-title-for-chuck-5-12/
Huh.
No doubt its about raging hormones…
Could be if she’s pregnant. Isn’t episode 12 follow on from 11? In which case they’re stuck in a hostage situation.
It’s probably not even as bad as it sounds.
I’m sure its not as bad as it sounds. Ill advised title, but Fedak is a bit off on publicity. I’m betting a fun ride the rest of the season.
I agree 🙂
Chuck vs the Baby wasn’t as bad as Dave was making it out to be. Chuck didn’t steel any baby candy. Chuck vs Casey, I mean the Colonel, is considered one of the best episodes. It’s nothing to worry about. Maybe it’s just a video game tournament to decide if Chuck gets his game chairs in the living room.
Hey now, I was joking!
But if Sarah is pregnant and Chuck steals her candy, Sarah will not be kidding. She is a trained assassin with concealed knifes.
Mr. & Mrs. Smith. 😉
i won’t speculate yet, it’s to early but i hope it’s good. my fear is with the bread crumbs they have been dropping it my guess makes sense. i said early this year that sarah unwittingly is part of the big bad’s plans. we have had her pass a lie detector test in BT, now they selected her specifically for the chuck mission. my fear is more comes out that it was her job early on to entice chuck to join the CIA and this leads to bad times in 5.12. i did post photos of her working with another male agent in 5.13 in berlin. my fear is they have them split for a time in 5.12 and then flash forward to her coming back in 5.13 near the end.everyone would still be happy because they will end the show together.
Here’s a screencap from the promo for next week. Read the caption and look at Sarah. http://neuralmente.tumblr.com/post/15092453208
Thanks, seems kind of early but could be!
We know how misleading promos can be. They’ve already shown in it that Sarah could be pregnant, surely it wouldn’t be as obvious as that. Could it? And going back to your point Army about Sarah somehow being a part of the conspiracy – interesting theory, especially if she didn’t actually realise what was happening.
Yeah Lappers I’m certain if she had a role to play it was unknowing. In a way, she and Chuck will get their revenge by undoing whatever was planned with some of the very tools intended to bring Chuck down (Sarah?)
Totally agree with that Dave. It will be sweet victory for the Bartowski’s.
If someone was trying to use Sarah in all of this, Graham may have been involved somehow, which many of us have suspected.
She may be drinking water, but there is a glass of champagne in front of her. But, I wonder why there is champagne.
It’s probably coincidence that she is drinking water in that shot, but it’s fun to speculate. It could be that Sarah is late, hasn’t told Chuck, and doesn’t want to take a chance. Chuck notices she didn’t touch the champagne (he isn’t a completely incompetent spy), leading to the pregnancy test later.
The title of 5.12 is out, and being report by Zap2it and by Mel at ChuckTV.net.
It’s a shocker.
It’s Chuck vs. Sarah.
That adds light to something I’ve wondered about the BTS shots from the time that episode was filming. Lots of Chuck, Casey, and Morgan in mission gear, but no Sarah.
Of course she may be holding back from the action if she’s expecting.
I’m just glad we get those last two in one night, so no real cliffie.
That wouldn’t explain the title, though.
Subsequent BTS photos for 513 have her back in the action. I saw pictures of her stuntdouble in a Wienerlicious outfit.
Of course Weinerlicious could easily mean flashback.
I’m really not going to try to guess too much from the title. It could mean anything or be misleading. It’s not too hard to imagine a wide range of rivalry, dispute, or fun that could temporarily place them on opposing sides.
I simply do not believe it will be a big deal.
Gotta be a flash back or a dream. Why on earth would the Wienerliscious ever come back? (Especially if Sarah is pregnant. How many ways can you spell barf?)
There’s a picture of Chuck in a Wienerlicious uniform (the male kind) also.
https://twitter.com/#!/WellDaisy/media/slideshow?url=pic.twitter.com%2F9OtUKZoT
It doesn’t look like a flashback to me.
This is the penultimate episode. It’s often the penultimate episode when things look darkest for the team. Papa B was killed in one. Last season, Sarah was poisoned with the Norseman in the penultimate episode. In episode 412, which would have been the next to last episode, if it hadn’t gotten renewed, Casey was thrown off the roof. Episode 312 ended with Sarah going off with Shaw, not knowing he’d gone bad.
It’s kind of Fedak’s pattern to make things really bad for Team B in the next to last episode, end it on a cliffhanger and then have Chuck pull out all stops and save the day in the finale.
I’m fully expecting 512 and 513 to follow that pattern. I’m not taking it lightly.
The only exception was Colonel, which ended on a positive note.
When I said “this is the penultimate episode”, I was referring to “Chuck vs. Sarah”. The picture with the Wienerlicious outfits was during the filming of 513.
I can’t find the picture of the stuntwoman with the same hairdo as Yvonne’s and wearing the uniform.
Right, dkd, except, though Colonel was a very positive episode, it had its bleak moments and ended with Roark thumbing a ride to the wedding. Gulp. 3.12 was positive in that Sarah was packing to run away with Chuck after his ILY x3 speech but then she went off with Shaw, not knowing he was bad. 4.23 was totally, wonderfully positive right up until the Norseman strike. Subway and Gobbler had TeamB in deep dung pretty much the whole way through, but both episodes had their Chuck-good moments. So the penultimate episodes, have always been a mix of positive stuff + danger, ending with things looking somewhere between bad and desperate for TeamB. Some are weighted more heavily toward darkness and danger than others.
I expect 5.12 to be weighted toward the dark and dangerous — trouble early on and a cliffy with our heroes in dire straights (yet not without some wonderful Chuck moments). I echo everyone’s sentiment that I am glad we get 12 & 13 back to back.
There’s definitely a “darkest before the dawn” vibe to those penultimate episodes.
I’ve been wondering if, this time, Chuck will be put in a position where he has to re-intersect in order to save the day, basically forced to choose between “normal life” and saving everything.
Could be funny if Chuck and Sarah buy a Weinerlicious to compliment their Buy More business. They’d finally have something to put into the old Orange Orange spot…
That would be funny, Dave … but I keep remembering the clothes smelling like sausage remark (*wrinkles nose*). I guess if they own it, they don’t have to work there (much).
BTW, if Decker is dead and the CI is welcome to return to the CIA, why isn’t their 40 mil unfrozen? Then the house and retirement would be no problem. More baddies to come before that can happen, I suppose.
The money probably isn’t unfrozen yet because the government never does anything so fast! It will probably take three or four years…
I wouldn’t be surprised if the frozen funds are never brought up again by the writers.
Yeah DKD we will most likely never hear of it again.
Could just mean them at odds on what to name the imminent baby 😛
Samantha Lisa vs Fifika….
Fifika Morgan
Well, a pregnancy could have several Chuck vs Sarah scenarios. The name is one, but what Sarah should still be doing/not doing is another.
Isn’t 12 when they’re supposed to suffer a terrible loss? If there is a pregnancy, I’m still specking a miscarriage as the terrible loss. They’ve pushed some heavy dramatic stories, which I have actually liked, since it was about them facing it all together. Facing things together has been a pretty constant theme.
Miscarriage would be dramatic and powerful. Whatever it is I don’t believe we’re going to see Chuck and Sarah at odds in any profound way, at least not for long.
Agreed, Dave.
The new promo for Chuck vs. The Kept Man is up top. What’s not there is my immediate and uncontrolled reaction…
SQUEEEEE!!!!
Squeee relay tower echoing your squeee, Joe. 🙂
uh dunno? the reaction should have happened since they showed that one after the ep? so it is three days old, maybe that’s it?
I have a little speculation about what may be coming over the next few weeks. I think Sarah will get a positive pregnancy test this week but there has been a spoiler out for a while about Chuck and Sarah suffering a great loss at some point. My feeling is depending on which episode that was from and I can’t remember exactly, she will have a miscarriage. That will be their great loss. Not Casey or whatever. In the final episode we will see a future scene with Chuck and Sarah and their child(ren).
I think you’re exactly right in all of that Uplink.
I’m 50/50 on whether she will be pregnant this week. I’m having hard reconciling that with the descriptions of the following episodes that have her going off on missions. Yvonne tweeted from filming 511 that she was doing fights in high heels.
The only reason I’m not certain she’s NOT pregnant is that they might come up with an explanation for that.
To add fuel to the speculation fire, did anyone notice in the promo that when Casey starts shooting the machine gun, Chuck kind of protectively ushers Sarah under the table? Verbansky just stands there.
Typical Chuck move? Or is he being extra protective?
This is mostly for the guys – These are the hottest pictures of Yvonne I’ve ever seen; maybe the hottest of all time.
Yet, they’re surprisingly family friendly. (They’re probably best considered NSFW, though.)
Behind the scenes for Yvonne’s latest photo shoot.
So Chuck vs the Kept Man, is Casey to be the kept man? is that the proposition that Gertrude has for him or merely Casey’s interpretation of that proposition. Also am I the only one that has a worry that Gertrude might not survive the episode, TPTB have killed of characters before, but not for a while and we are due for another suprising death and we care enough about Gertrude now to make it count.
I’m thinking Casey doesn’t want to become a kept man. Also, maybe Jeff figures out Sarah is an owner of the Buy More and thinks Chuck is a kept man.
It could have multiple meanings. When the episode title was first announced, they said the bad guys would be two brothers and one of those brothers was the “kept man” of the title.
But, I like the idea of Casey thinking he would become one, given Gertrude is a successful businesswoman. But, Casey’s status with Carmichael will be up in the air if Chuck and Sarah get out of the spying business and convert it to a computer business, as has been hinted as the direction they want to go in. Where does that leave him?
Chuck vs the Kept man sneak peek: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TFQ-Qk2_fNo
Hilarious! Promises to be some of the best Jeff/Lester/Buymore stuff yet.
I like the direction this is going in, but I wonder if they are going to take it all the way and have Jeff figure it out by the end. They could have them ALMOST figure it out, but fail.
Or it might lead to Jeff or Lester’s tragic demise.
I would love to have Jeff figure it out. In fact I would love for Jeff to figure it out, find Castle, understand what heroes they are … and have Lester think Jeff is crazy. (What kinda name is Cia?)
My theory for now (I retain the right to change my mind on a whim!) is that Jeff will become the “new Chuck” by the end of the show. That is, he’ll be the compitent Nerd Herder that makes sure things run correctly. That seems likely to involve involve some knowledge of the relationship between Chuck, Sarah, Buy More, and spy world. I think its going to be a lot of fun to see this snooping pay off.
As long as another Vicky Vale look-alike doesn’t walk in to steal his secrets. That might be a little creepy.
I love that scenario, Dave. I find it totally appealing and very likely.
Wearing a cashmere v-neck… Who are you John Casey?
Finale two episode synopses.
================
“CHUCK VERSUS SARAH”
01/27/2012 (08:00PM – 09:00PM) (Friday) : SARAH MUST KEEP A SECRET FROM CHUCK IN ORDER TO ACCOMPLISH A MISSION — ANGUS MACFADYEN GUEST STARS AS ‘NICHOLAS QUINN’ — After a harrowing mission, Sarah (Yvonne Strahovski) returns to Chuck (Zachary Levi) with a huge secret. Meanwhile, Ellie (Sarah Lancaster) and Awesome (Ryan McPartlin) are presented with a new opportunity that could change their lives. Adam Baldwin and Joshua Gomez also star.
“CHUCK VERSUS THE GOODBYE”
01/27/2012 (09:00PM – 10:00PM) (Friday) : CHUCK’S FINAL MISSION BRINGS HIM BACK TO HIS ROOTS AS HE FIGHTS TO SAVE HIS FUTURE – ANGUS MACFADYEN AND LINDA HAMILTON GUEST STAR — Chuck (Zachary Levi) enlists his family, friend and some unexpected allies as he races to stop Nicholas Quinn (guest star Angus Macfadyen, “Braveheart”) from destroying everything Chuck has built over the past five years. Yvonne Strahovski, Joshua Gomez, Adam Baldwin, Sarah Lancaster, Scott Krinsky, Vik Sahay and Mark Christopher Lawrence also star.
================
Everyone take a breath and don’t read too much into “return” and “secret”. She could have been returning from a regular Carmichael Industries mission he knew about and could be telling him the secret she discovered on the mission.
Ack! Crossing posts! Thanks, Jeff.
I would say you could edit my post and remove the middle, but I at least spelled synopses correctly. 😉 Got to leave that because it makes up for my other typos and word substitutions I notice after hitting “Post Comment.”
I’m really tired of the “keeping big secrets” motif. Again I don’t expect it to be some awful thing, but they’re back to the negative promotion thing again.
The write-up for “Goodbye” sort of looks like the routine write-up for any ending action-adventure series.
Of course I’m excited regardless, and very glad we’ll get them both in one night.
Dave i agree, i think the secret is she found out her mom is in with the big bad. that would cruse him, lol.
Everyone take a breath and don’t read too much into “return” and “secret”.
Jeff, you do realize this is the Chuck fandom you’re talking about, don’t you?
😉
I knew I was forgetting something. Thanks for clearing that up, Ernie. 🙂
I’m gonna call it now: Sarah is pregnant and doesn’t want to tell Chuck because if he knew, he’d try to stop her from going on missions (as he should).
That was my thought, only she finds out during the mission and returns with the news as the big secret.
well i have a few, lol. but yours does make more sense because then they can fight about it, lol.
That was my first guess too. Although it leaves me wondering what the big loss is…
Maybe we’re back to a character death.
MXPW… while i do agree, i hope they don’t go that route. if she does find out shes pregnant during the mission and decides to finish it i will lose all respect i have for sarah. to knowing put your unborn child at risk for a job appalls me to no end. so i really hope they don’t go that route.
I think that’s premature army, we know nothing about what the mission is. Something that involves the well being of the entire family, the child’s father, Sarah’s own life, or nuclear war could easily be important enough to make finishing the mission a priority. And I don’t mean that to sound trite, there really are situations that could make finishing the job at hand of paramount importance. In fact I expect such a situation anyway; whatever Sarah’s secret is, the mission will be something so important it CANNOT be neglected.
Sorry Dave not to me. she is not the only one that is alive, or capable. she could be replaced, end of story for me.
Its not that hard to construct a scenario where she’s the only one for the job (physical opportunity, unique knowledge or history, etc).
I’m not denying they could fumble the story or motivation. I just think its WAY premature to start throwing out judgments with zero data.
Pregnancies for people with semi-dangerous or very dangerous jobs is a sticky subject. Despite how Devon acted in early S4, pregnant women are not invalids. When the right time to start desk duty or leave is a question that many people would have different answers to, depending on things like the exact job and the overall health and age of the mother-to-be. It is not a black and white issue.
I’ve seen MANY Stargate fanfics address this issue as well as a few Castle fanfics. Those universes have a Major/Lt. Colonel and NYPD detective whose characters would not want to sit back and do nothing, but are required to follow orders. Sarah doesn’t have to follow orders anymore. She would just have to follow her own conscience, and put up with with her overly protective husband.
In fictional stories, the mother-to-be’s wishes are rarely the issue. They are in Bones. This season, Bones tackled a suspect while Booth was beside himself trying to get her to take it easy and show some common sense. I thought it was funny the way they presented it.
Instead, it’s usually circumstances outside of their control. In Alias S5, Sydney mentored another agent because she was pregnant. For the most part she tried to say safe, but that didn’t prevent her from being kidnapped when the baby was almost due. In Kill Bill, the Bride finds out she is pregnant right before someone is about to kill her. If she hadn’t convinced the assassin to let her go, she wouldn’t have had a choice.
It all depends on the context and presentation. Sarah might be staying in the van, but then it’s never safe in the van.
Dave Jeff, while i do see your point and value your opinions all i ask is you value mine as well. as for FF yeah you do see crazy stuff there as well, people get shot and are on their death beds and the next day they are up and about chasing bad guys. doesn’t mean i agree with that either. as for bones i saw that as well hated her for it, as well as lost respect so i am consistent. again Dave and Jeff this is a what if type of deal.
part of it could be personal as well. we don’t let pregnant women in the war zone, no exceptions. if they get pregnant there they are sent home within 10 days. i’m not sure how other high risk jobs are but i bet almost the same holds true for law enforcement and fire department folks that are on the street or exposed to risks.
i don’t think pregnant women are invalids. i have 3 kids and my wife worked up to the last days. so i know all about that part of it.
I wasn’t completely disagreeing with you, Army, especially in real life. I guess what I was trying to say fits into two categories
1) Sarah would probably think the van is safe, but we (and Chuck) know it isn’t. It might not be her fault. She might misjudge the danger.
2) I wouldn’t be surprised by anything. It is a TV Trope after all: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/PregnantBadass . The best example from their list is the one from Farscape: Peacekeeper Wars. Aeryn Sun shoots her gun at bad guys while in labor. Her funny line is “Shooting makes me feel better!” Then again, Aeryn Sun was an alien from a genetically engineered offshoot of humans bred to be soldiers, so it was a little less surprising. The things you see in sci-fi…
I hoping the whole miscarriage idea doesn’t happen and there’s no pregnancy until the very end of the finale. Then this discussion is moot.
Take a look at the credits for the last episode. did you notice the actor NOT listed? let the speculation on that begin!
In the second to last one, Ellie and Awesome take the opportunity, so they are not in the last episode.
Oh that’s a thought. So maybe their departure is the “loss” Fedak was talking about.
Dave, Jeff: SL is listed in the credits and not RM.
Thanks, Army. I misread right over the name “Sarah”. Wrong Sarah.
Jeff, NP, trust me i read it several times just to make sure i said it right. that’s why it stuck out to me.
Mel at Chucktv, who sometimes has inside info, says she knows RM is in the last episode. Linda Hamilton was in that final call video, which means she was hanging out on set or was in scenes during the last day of filming. Now I don’t know if someone will die or if Dave’s loss==leaving idea is right.
Jeff again thanks! maybe it’s just a typo. then again maybe its done via flash back and they only list credits for those that actually acted during the filming of the episodes and not for scenes they already got credit for? just a guess on that part though.
These synopses have left out actors before and they’ve been in the episode. RM was definitely in many of the behind the scenes pictures.
DKD true. i haven’t seen any behind the scenes photos but i know if i was an actor on that show and was as friendly as they all seem to be, i would want to be around the set if they were filming the last episode ever of the show, even if i wasn’t in it.
I’m aware of that. But, I can tell when an actor is in “costume” vs. visiting the set in their regular clothes. Also, his stand-in was there and they had his director’s chair there. They only do that if you are filming.
DKD thanks, like i said i haven’t seen the pictures so all i have to go on is the synopsis.
I think the wording is strange. The all capital letter sentence seems to indicate that she keeps something from him before the mission but then the next sentence makes it seem as if the secret arises during the mission. Or maybe I am just reading it wrong. It has been a long day.
i think they both say the same. it means to bring about or bring to completion. so she is already involved when she finds out the secret and decides to finish the mission without telling chuck, then has to tell chuck when she gets back.
We have some official synopsises (synopsii? Synopseeses? Charlezzessses?) from Spoiler TV for both 5.12 (Chuck vs. Sarah) and 5.13 (Chuck vs. The Goodbye).
-,- <—- my face at this point in time. I think it accurately displays my feelings.
Eyes closed and nose out of joint?
don’t make fun of my facial structure 😦
Sorry, that’s one emoticon I’m not familiar with. Something like this 😮 or this
or even this 😥 I get. Wasn’t quite sure what you were going for.
LOL! Don’t make fun of my facial structure…
That’s taking the emoticon REAL seriously!
uh, if I were to define it, it would be something like
“vaguely annoyed/bored/annoyed”
also, my expression continued to morph into (once again, don’t mind the facial structure :D) t(-,-t)
Another Kept Man sneak peek (#2): Be sure to put down your drinks before watching this one:
safe.tumblr.com/safe/video/15355933496/500
Thanks for the warning, that was funny as heck.
Funnnnnnnyyyyyyy!!!!
LOL. Brilliant. Loved the Seduction Impossible reference
I’m guessing right now that these next two episodes will be played mostly for laughs; before the final arc. I just hope they leave enough time at the end of 5.13 for a feel good wrap up.
This is Chuck, so I doubt. It the end is always rushed. Then again, there is no need for a Ring 2.0 fight, Orion Cave, or Morgansect download to kick off a new season. That would give them enough time to replay the family scene from Chuck vs the Baby, with Mary and Clara digitally added in.
It is a little different this time since they really KNOW this is the end. I know it’s not their normal way if writing, I just really hope for something different this time.
My biggest hope for the finale is Chuck and Sarah on screen together rather than separated most of the time. I know the show is “Chuck” but I’d like the hero moment to be shared, too.
Here’s a link to Chuck Versus the Bo promo.
Looks pretty exciting … can’t wait … can’t stand knowing the end is so near.
yeah “the end” part is tearing me up.
While ‘Chuck’ has had plenty of drama, I don’t personally believe Sarah will suffer a miscarriage… at least I hope so.
It just seems too dark storyline for ‘Chuck’, and especially when coming so close to the end there wouldn’t be enough time to treat such a serious matter properly. Plus at least in my eyes it would forever taint the ending, no matter how happy they try to make it otherwise.
http://www.tvline.com/2012/01/yvonne-strahovski-surprised-by-chuck-series-finale/
Interesting interview. I know she’s previously said how she “hoped” the series would end, and given that I liked her vision I’m a little disappointed by her reaction.
But that said, she used the words “almost” tragic which suggests to me things do actually work out well. My guess is though, we won’t get the “happy” until the VERY end. Bummer, but at least we’ve had many of those big Bartowski family and friends events over the years to remember. As long as our favorite characters are standing and together (well, Chuck/Sarah, Devon/Ellie together; the rest just standing!) I think I can live with a little drama!
I guess specifically I’m thinking we’ll never know things like if they bought their dream house and filled it with kids. I had hoped we would, but I’m currently expecting we won’t.
If everyone is in a good place, Chuck and Sarah can visit Emma and Molly at their white house with a red door. Sarah could even break into the dream house, rip out the carved door frame, and nail it to the wall in the apartment.
I always thought the dream house was a nice idea, but seemed a little small to fill with lots of kids. Living by the Woodcombs, Casey, and Morgan (and the future Mrs. Grimes) was better. They should have just bought out the apartment complex. Grass could be planted around the fountain. The Woodcombs and Bartowskis could break down walls and expand their apartments. Morgan and Alex could take a place. Casey could get his man cave back, using Morgan’s room to store Gertrude’s weapons stash.
As long as our favorite characters are standing and together
That about sums it up for me, Dave.
Re: dream house: Perhaps we’ll know that one day they will. The doorframe has to be there for a reason. 😉
My excitement level for the finale doubled when I read that story.
The last thing that I want is for it to be predictable. If Yvonne was surprised, then I’m that much happier right now.
Wow. There’s going to be discussion about this endlessly, even past the 27th, I imagine.
Yvonne’s words are well chosen. I have a feeling that “…slightly, slightly, tragic” translates to “bitter-sweet” in my mind. So the question remains, how bitter?
We have the clue from almost two months ago about a death. So long as it’s not one of the beloved characters (with the possible exception of Jeff and/or Lester), that would qualify. I hope they realize that any potential child of Chuck&Sarah is already beloved by the fans, btw.
How bitter? Casey likes his coffee black and bitter. Of course that was in the middle of season 3, so some people would consider that very bitter.
Killing smart Jeff might be slightly, slightly tragic. Killing Lester might be a good thing.
I was surprised about the way Emmitt met his fate. That was about as shocking as I could take, I think.
For some reason, the strange, strange ending to The Sopranos keeps coming to my mind too. That ending was about as wide-open to interpretation as you could imagine. It left everything up to your imagination, in fact. It could have been nothing, or Tony’s whole family could have been wiped out. We don’t know.
And that made it way too frustrating for some.
At the time, I really liked the way Emmitt died. Now I’m torn. Part of me wishes there were a few more episodes with the Buy More under his dictatorial control. I thought the S3 Buy More plots were really weak (except for Beard and Ring II). Maybe Emmitt would have helped.
Chuck’s dad’s death was the shocking one for me.
“Slightly tragic” is thinking it’s a hero’s death. Pre-season, I would have thought that would be Casey or Morgan. Now with the two of them in promising relationships, I’m leaning to Chuck mom. She would try to save her family to make up for twenty years. However, she was around in the final cast video, so that doesn’t make sense for a death in 5.12.
I think a big heroic death for Mary would fit the description perfectly. Much better than a miscarriage. And remember, Stephen appeared quite a bit in the episode AFTER his death. Similar structure perhaps?
I thought of a couple more things that might be considered “slightly” tragic, by comparison to regular tragic:
– a severe injury, like paralysis. Morgan or Casey is more likely than Chuck or Sarah. Although for those that want Chuck to have the Intersect at the end (I’m indifferent), maybe the Intersect would rewire Chuck’s brain to fix the injury (or would that be too much like Avatar).
– Sarah finds out she can’t have children
A serious/lasting injury would seem to qualify; but I bet they don’t go the no kids route. I mean, I’m not sure we’ll know either way, but can’t see them “taking that away” so to speak.
Of course the Intersect does bring up a good question; does it return? I’m also of the camp that doesn’t really care. I think I would be excited by a temporary re-Intersecting; like Ellie has figured out how to insert and remove it. I can see a few other scenarios working with it, the previously mentioned Sarah getting the Intersect could be interesting. But if the show ends with Chuck being re-Intersected and the whole team back in the agency I think I would be disappointed.
I don’t know. It will be interesting.
Fedak first mentioned a death at Comic-con. While the man can twist the truth out of shape sometimes, pretty much everything else he said at that Comic-con panel came true, including his hint about “frosted tips”.
On the panel, it was implied that it was somebody on the panel that wouldn’t make it to the end of the season, but that’s up to interpretation whether he was limiting himself to the panel. Zac pointed at himself as a joke.
Now that was a long time ago, though, and they weren’t even near writing the finale.
While a Mama B death should be a possibility, I wouldn’t eliminate anyone at this point. And by “anyone”, I mean I personally have Chuck or Sarah on my list of possibilities, albeit with lower probability than other characters.
Yes and we discussed that a lot at the time. While theoretically any character is a possibility for a death, I think to most of us Chuck or Sarah getting killed would be tragic to the point of ruining the entire five year experience. I promise I would never re-watch another episode if that happened. And I’m pretty sure Fedak isn’t THAT clueless to produce such a distasteful ending.
Killing off Casey would still fit the criteria. But I think killing off anyone else would likely be too dark for most of us.
Which isn’t to say no show runner has ever totally destroyed their show with a poorly conceived finale before….
But I’ll stay optimistic for now and say Chuck and Sarah will probably be fine. (if I wasn’t being optimistic now might be a good time stop watching the show!)
I don’t know if I feel the same way. Tragic can also be incredibly romantic and memorable. Look at Romeo & Juliet. It’s a classic.
I think the ending of BSG when Adama is with Roslin as she dies is one of the most romantic things, I’ve ever seen.
Totally disagree DKD. I’ve always seen Romeo and Juliet as comically overwrought; sort of a self parody, like Elvis.
And BSG, well I thought that was so outrageously dark I dumped it from my DVR after S1.
Don’t get me wrong, I can imagine how they might kill off Sarah (the description for Goodbye mentions Chuck, but not Sarah) and give us sappy tripe about “how she changed his life” and “made him into the man he is” and “a part of her will always be with him” blah, blah, blah. And reading between the lines of Yvonne’s interview above suggests to me she doesn’t really like the ending much.
But in the end that would just be depressing for most of us (I think). And Yvonne’s description of the end is “almost tragic” and “satisfying.”. Given that she’s been the most in tune with us ‘shippers for quite some time, I think she would have phrased things very differently if Sarah went out in a blaze of glory. More like “intense” or “epic”; but probably not “satisfying”.
I admit, I’m far more worried about this end than I was a few days ago. But I still don’t actually expect them to go too dark with the ending. And Sarah as worm food is the very definition of dark.
To each his own. The beginning of Romeo & Juliet is romantic, but I’ll never consider a double suicide romantic. Tragic and memorable, yes, unfortunately. But not romantic.
The Roslin/Adama ending might have been romantic, but my WTF reaction to the final five cylon twist and Starbuck’s Eye of Jupiter quest was probably as strong as some people’s reaction to Morgansect. So I would have missed the romance that probably was there. Roslin made as much sense being a cylon as the seemingly random cast members they picked. To me it made the old Earth/new Earth thing and the finale (which bothered some) seemed normal by comparison.
I’m hoping Chuck doesn’t go weird like that show did.
Yeah Jeff I’m also hoping they don’t go too weird. Given that “normal” has been a recurring theme and goal I don’t think they will, but we’ll see!
I guess this is a “to each his own” discussion. I like “dark” and BSG was just my cup of tea. I also like a good cry.
FWIW, if either Chuck or Sarah were to die, I would see Chuck as the more likely candidate. It’s ultimately his hero’s story and heroes can go out in a blaze of glory saving everyone else. It would be much more fitting to that to have him die, survived by Sarah who is pregnant and ultimately has his child. Cut to many years later and the child and Sarah are on the beach and she says, “Let me tell you about your father.”
Now, that’s an ending. I guess I like tragic love stories.
(I’m not predicting it, mind you. I don’t think Fedak has the guts to do it.)
DKD I do agree killing Chuck off would be a better end; as you say, a pregnant Sarah surrounded by her new friends and family would be fitting in its own way.
But where you say no guts I say good taste and sense. Chuck has consistently returned to a “happy place” after every story or arc; I think Fedak knows he’s built an audience that expects and requires that. I can safely say I would never patronize anything by him again if he “broke contract” with us now and ended too dark.
I take “Sarah + Chuck” on the door frame to be a promise not a cenotaph.
“(I’m not predicting it, mind you. I don’t think Fedak has the guts to do it.)”
Well, I think he’s smart enough not to do it. 😉
Yeah ditto that Jam!
A new Interview with Yvonne is up in which she clarifies her “slightly tragic” quote a little. It seems “something is taken away from Chuck and Sarah”.
This sort of ends the whole “will Chuck or Sarah be killed off?” line of thinking to me. It kind of puts the miscarriage idea at the front of the list to me. Although killing off Mary, Casey or Morgan still might be possibilities.
Interesting conversation!
I don’t think killing off Chuck or Sarah is a matter of having “balls” or not – but it would be completely inconsistent with the established tone of the show, and I think that’s the most important reason not to do it. If they’d stayed with the darker tone of S3, I could just about imagine it – but not after the lighter tone of S4 and (most of) S5. That level of dark, even if they made it bitter sweet, would just be too much for this show.
One of the secondary characters? Sure. They did that in Season 3 and I can see them going there again. But Chuck or Sarah? Not in a million years.
Um… Is the interviewer implying that Yvonne is going to be in the SI Sports Illustrated Swimsuit issue? I think it can be interpreted either way.
Joe she is going to be in it. the same shots that are already out i believe.
Kev good point about S3 and tone of the show. Although I would add, even in S3 the main arc ended well; they just took a longer path getting there (waaaay longer, oops sorry, that wast just cranky Dave speaking up…).
Dave, I thought the ‘c’ was for ‘controller’, not ‘cranky’.
those are often synonymous terms!
I think this was leaked earlier, but Ben Browder (from Farscape and S9-10 of Stargate SG-1) will be in Chuck vs the Bullet Train. Part of me is wishing he was the big bad for the final arc. He robbed a criminal bank in S2 of Farscape (like Chuck vs the Bank of Evil), and he even wrote the funny Stargate episode “Bad Guys”, where they accidentally take a bunch of civilians hostage. He’s great in action-comedies, but I’m thinking he’s going to be very under utilized as a bad guy heavy.
I really enjoyed Browder in the last two seasons of SG-1. I agree he’s unlikely to be fully utilized as a one-shot baddie on Chuck, but it will be fun to see what they come up with.
Hey Joe aren’t you like 60 yrs old and you’re still perving over Yvonne’s skinsuit photos like a schoolboy. I feel sorry for your wife to be honest. Yvonne Strahovski did this shoot for money pure and simple.
Um, isn’t that why all people do anything like this photoshoot? It’s not like she’s doing it for the lols.
You mean she didn’t do it so that some middle aged guy in a provincial Canadian city would see it and fly to LA to sweep her off her feet? I’m disillusioned.
herder I’m sure that’s exactly what her motive was…
Just, you know, respect the restraining order and keep on believing that…
Don’t listen to Dave, Herder.
You and I both know that those restraining orders are more like guidelines…
Don’t worry, just so long as I don’t start seeing coded messages to me in the body paint or in her lines in the show I’m safe.
Whoops, I meant secret coded messages that none of the rest of you could see, you know the ones meant only for me.
Thanks for kicking in that open door Sandra. I’m pretty sure most people weren’t aware of this… o.o
Actually Sandra I feel a little sorry for you. Searching all those posts to find the one single one on this blog that acknowledges something that is buzzing across the Chuck-verse just so you could get your nose out of joint and accuse someone of something inappropriate must be tough work.
I’ll save you some time. I find Yvonne Strahovski extremely attractive. I also find Sarah Lancaster, Mekenna Melvin, Mini Anden and Bonita Fredricy (in her own inimitable cougarish way) to be attractive. Hell, I’ll go even further. Zac Levi and Ryan McPartlin are attractive men. I’ll even agree that Adam Baldwin’s jaw was carved by Michelangelo himself. Now that I have acknowledged that attractive people in Hollywood get paid, in part, to be attractive, can we drop the personal attacks?
Truth be told, Ryan McPartlin is a fine specimen. And that jaw HAS to have been chiseled.
Hum… Sandra, I’m getting near 60, but I’M NOT DEAD YET!!!
And Mrs. Joe is sorta glad I’m not, btw.
Joe is enthusiastic but he’s always been polite and a gentleman about it! Men will notice women; really, we’re made that way. Of course we must balance our impulses with our love and respect for our spouse. But I’ve seen nothing here that looks disrespectful to either a spouse or to Yvonne herself. And money or no, I’m sure she’d be pleased to hear a man say “wow you look great!” And most women, unless they’re horribly insecure would likely agree.
And I never get what the age has to do with it. Should a 50-something man not notice a beautiful 30 year old? Both parties are adults by any definition. In almost any age or culture other than our own such age differences are common. My wife is 7 years younger than me, does that make me a cradle robber or something?
We are all here because we love the show Chuck. A show that is a comedy first and foremost. It’s hardly surprising we often kid around together. Please take our comments in that spirit. We all want to keep this a family friendly place, and I think both principals and guests have generally done well in moderating their comments accordingly.
I don’t believe this. I’m a middle-aged roue and life-long bachelor who has vanity plates on my table at Delilah’s and you think Gentleman Joe is a perv?
What am I, chopped liver?
If you think that the most polite, affable and optimistic poster to this blog is a pervert, I’m not doing my job right. Tell me, Joe, what is it? The Hat? It is the Hat, isn’t it?
Dang, I knew I should have gotten a fedora to match my trench coat.
Ah, VV. You’re not half the perv you think you are. I’ll put my perviness up against yours any day! 😉
But, back on topic, here’s Yvonne’s latest interview. She discusses, briefly, the photo-shoot in question, confirms that, yes, she’ll be in SI come Feb. 14, that she liberated 2 watches from the set of Chuck and that working with Cheryl Ladd was much like working with her mother!
She said Chuck vs Sarah was going to be about a conflict between them. Considering what happened to Morgan when he was Intersected, I’m thinking Chuck is brainwashed to think Sarah is an enemy. Maybe Robert the Bruce was a rival of Orion’s who messed with Volkoff’s Intersect, causing that problem. But I’m also thinking it is resolved/restored by early in Chuck vs the Goodbye, so that episode is about taking out Robert the Bruce so Chuck and Sarah can have their happily ever after.
Jeff, brain washing? yeah i agree. in fact a few weeks ago i suggested a manchurian candidate type scenario. maybe this weeks bravest moment is her undoing it or starting it to save chuck? thats why casey yells no. again just a guess. they could a lot with the brain washing bit that comes to a head in c vs s.
Definitely not one of my favorite themes to explore (brain washing/mind control); but if Chuck and Sarah are going to be at odds in some way (5.12) its better than actually having one of them be a major jerk.
I’m thinking it may be Sarah who gets brainwashed though, since the 5.13 write-up says its Chuck fighting for his future etc, etc. No mention of Sarah. Now we know from interviews with Yvonne that Sarah is apparently present throughout the episode, but it seems likely to me she’s the one being fought FOR in some way. Should we be surprised? Another finale with Chuck fighting for a neutralized Sarah? Not to make too big a thing of an episode we haven’t even seen yet; but its been a regular thing that I like mid-season episodes far better than the finales…
I’m thinking Sarah’s bravest moment is independent of what happens… sort of a Phase 3 moment, except she is thinking more clearly. If it starts in this episode and continues, then Chuck still would be brainwashed in Bullet Train. The plot synopsis for that episode implies they are working together. It says “Sarah (Yvonne Strahovski) and Chuck (Zachary Levi) must face the merciless Nicholas Quinn” not the ambiguous “Sarah (Yvonne Strahovski), Chuck (Zachary Levi), and the merciless Nicholas Quinn face off”
I had forgotten about your Manchurian Candidate idea. It makes more sense now that we know more. I’m still not convinced, but it’s a possible theory. (I’m still humming loudly and ignoring your other one.)
With Mary coming back for the final episode, would that make her Angela Landsbury? Then again, the twitter pics from the finale have YS’s hair styled a little like AL’s:
http://p.twimg.com/Af__bawCAAAISFM.jpg:large
I’m thinking if some sort of mind control is involved we won’t see any impact from it until the end of Bullet Train. Leading to tension and angst in 5.12, and resolution in 5.13 (possibly not until the very end). That still sounds like WAY too much of that story cliche for my taste, but at least we’ll get those last two episodes back-to-back!
Dave, if it is self-contained in a single episode or has a first-scene cliffhanger resolved at the top of the 2nd hour, it might not be that bad. If it drags out over several episodes, I agree.
There are more midseason episodes, so there are more chances for them to be better. Looking at midseason “finales” in Ernie’s poll, I agree I like Push Mix better than Cliffhanger and Other Guy better than Ring II, but I like Ring better than Santa Claus, and Marlin great. I’m not worried about a trend. I think it’s a coincidence. All of the 13th episodes scored well (4.24 average brought down by Suburbs, which I liked despite the ending) and “finales” scored really high, with an average of 4.36. Since I rate episodes higher than the typical chuckthisblog voter, that rounds up to a 5 for me. So have some statistical faith. 🙂
Oh I’m not overly worried Jeff, and I have generally liked the finales. But I think my favorite may have been Merlin which was never intended to be a finale! Push Mix and Cliffhanger were the most completely satisfying to me.
I guess my only point there being that I prefer the longer and sweet family interactions; while the tendency seems to be for slam/bang action packed finales right to the last moment. Doesn’t mean I won’t like it, but it does mean there’s a reasonable chance Baby will remain my favorite of the seasson.
Ditto that, Dave. I loved the family/happy part at the end of Baby (7 min). Baby felt less rushed because it wasn’t trying to do too much. We got Bartowski family stuff, including Chuck and Sarah’s part in that, as well as the fantastic Chuck and Sarah scene at the end.
The happy family stuff in Push Mix (also 7 min) seemed a little less satisfying, because there was too much stuff going on (and unfortunately too much Jeffster). The happy part of Cliffhanger (9 min) only felt rushed because of the set up for the next potential season.
If we got the 9 minutes of Cliffhanger without the extraneous nonsense of Push Mix and without the need to set up a new season like Cliffhanger; if we got the satisfying Bartowski style tie up of Baby, as well as the quintessential Chuck and Sarah ending like Baby, I’d be exstatic.
Even it it seems too little, too late, like OG, it will still be okay, because it’s not coming on the heels of a season of misery. It’s coming on the heels of what I consider to be two seasons of payoff … just a single trial/conflict (however bad and probably generated against them by the bad guys) in the life of a normal, happy marriage.
I’m still looking forward to it, but bracing myself for some pretty serious drama. When all is said and done, it could make the victory sweeter. After all, Yvonne did say, There will be a satisfying ending. She just said the lead up is slightly, slightly tragic. I just hope the tragic lead-up isn’t dragged too far into the finale.
The worst part, regardless of the details, is that it’s the end of Chuck.
Of course I agree with all of that Thinkling. I was a little disappointed when Yvonne suggested things would still be in doubt going into the last minute of the episode. Perhaps the statement shouldn’t be taken too literally. But I’m taking a lot of cues at this point from Yvonne; she seemed to indicate Baby was the most satisfying episode to her, so I’m guessing it will likely remain that way for me too. That’s okay, no season finale has ever been a season’s best for me anyway (except Other Guy if we regard the main part of S3 as a seperate entity). But apart from being a littlle down over the end of the series, now I’m also a little down that the best may be past…
That’s okay, I still look forward to these last episodes!
Maybe it’s two things, Dave. (At least, I’m hoping) Just like in Push Mix, Chuck and Sarah started out in a difficult spot (isolated, worried). Even after that was essentially resolved (when they met on the Contessa), there was a lot to resolve spy wise. Chuck and Sarah could resolve their conflict/tragedy and still have a bad guy to deal with, their future to fight for, and the day to save. That’s what I’m hoping. Chuck and Sarah angst until the last minute would be a disappointment.
Yvonne was obviously very surprise by the story line … disappointed? Maybe (whether because it was a drastic departure from her expectations, or because the story is disappointing, I don’t know). But ultimately she says it’s satisfying. *sigh*
At least they’re letting Yvonne do interviews. Just please, keep the mike away from Fedak. Yvonne does a good job of preparing us for some intense drama. She’s so sympathetic and in touch with fans (who –like her– want Chuck to have a happy ending), as opposed to CF, the diabolical teaser.
Hey I like your optimism! You’re right though, I hope Fedak stays in hiding until its over (I know, fat chance!) .
My Dear Tetrarch:
Since the idea of putting our pervinesses up against each other is immensely disturbing (on more than one level) , I hereby concede that you are very slightly more of a perv than me. But then I am NOT half the perv I think I am. I’m a pussy cat, a puppy dog, totally and completely harmless. Really, Ladies, I am.
Trust me.
I’ll jump in on this finale discussion. I think its always been hit or miss with them. Especially when you include the midseason ones.
Marlin is a great episode and worked well as a season finale even though it wasn’t supposed to be one. The writers strike changed that. I wasn’t around back then but even if they had only had a 13 ep order at first they would have gotten the pickup very quickly as the ratings for S1 were very strong.
I don’t view Santa Claus as a midseason finale because it wasn’t one. That season had a 22 ep order right from the beginning and it shows. But looking at it it was great. It’s interesting that Schwedak view it as a top 4 for them.
Ring 1 is a very strong episode as it sets up so many incredible possibilities and I was incredibly excited to see where they went from there. Too bad what we did get was so incredibly disappointing. Ring 1 suffers only in that it followed Colonel which for most fans is the best episode of S2 and for some the best ever. So all in all its a very good finale.
Other Guy is a good finale for me only in that it ends the misery arc. If you look at it more closely and get beyond just the 2 main scenes, to me at least its a god awful episode. There are so many plot holes and stupid stick moments that I can’t really watch it anymore. I just go to YouTube and see just the good scenes. I don’t even think it is the best episode of the first 13 and that is not a good sign. Overall I’d say that honor goes to Tic Tac, except for the final scene or Three Words except for how the final scene was ignored going forward.
Ring II suffers from a similar fate to Ring 1 in that it followed a much better episode in Subway. In fact Subway is probably my second favorite of the entire S3. Second to my all time favorite Honeymooners. It’s a very good episode and sets up the next arc well. Too bad in some respects the promise of that setup didn’t show through in the search for mom arc of S4.
Push Mix is one of the best of S4. Lots of great action leading up to a great final scene in the corridor. Of the 2 real known mid season finales it is the better by far.
Cliffhanger in many respects is weak. Mainly by omission. No reunion, no Casey walking Sarah down the aisle, not enough Sarah. It’s also weak at least in my view by inclusion. The final moment I hated. Especially when there was a very serious chance that is where the series would have ended. Did Fedak really think it was a great idea to end the series with Morgan? Really?
Now we come to Goodbye. I’ve decided for me to drop the expectations game. No matter what I think about what is to come, it isn’t going to change what they did and I certainly will watch. I just hope that Yvonne’s feelings about it being satisfying come true. But as this season was promoted as a love letter to the fans and in my mind it really hasn’t been, I’m trying to follow suit with Yvonne and realize that my expectations are what it will not be. But we shall see.
So for a personal ranking it goes like this.
1. Push Mix
2. Ring 1
3. Marlin
4. Ring II
5. Cliffhanger
6. Other Guy
Where Goodbye ends up is yet to be seen.
uplink i almost agree with the rankings. i’d drop push mix to 4 and move the others up. in push mix we had mogan suddenly becoming the yoga master and casey suddenly recovering from a fall that should have done more serious damage. when a doctor says he’ll wake up in a few days then bang it’s like a few minutes, well you get the idea. add to that the stupid wetsuit scene and it gets knocked down.
i have one complaint/worry so far on the finale and it’s simple really. why should fans only get a satisfying ending? much talk has been done here and on other blogs about the writers and how if they knew the exact number of episodes they were going to get that they would have done a better job. well here is/was their chance. they knew going in they had 13 episodes. so why couldn’t they give the fans a finale that blew them away vs one that is described as satisfying? a finale that when it gets talked about in the future leaves no question it was the best finale ever?
i can go to applebees to get a satisfying steak, i go to ruth chris to get a great one.
I think you are reading too much into the word “satisfying”, Army. Most TV shows do not have even “satisfying” endings, so I’ll take it.
To use your metaphor, Ruth Chris steaks cost a lot of money, but Chuck’s budget was cut before season 3 and now it’s only pulling in Friday ad revenues. Ruth Chris might be out of budget. Sad but true.
Jeff you could be right. as i said in a different post people’s ideas of what is satisfying to them is different. maybe this will explain better. at the end of the finale c/s are together and the big taken down, satisfying. c/s together big bad taken down and morgan dead, excellent. note: i have wanted morgan dead since ep 1 so that’s consistent because i hate the character and have since the beginning. just look at the FF i write, he’s either killed or in jail.
the comparison i was trying to make referred to the writing and not the production. the story should be what people talk about not the bangs and booms. a well written arc that makes sense, ties up loose ends is what i mean.
take the baby ep. we have had our differences about that one. do you want to see a finale that causes that much discussion with two opposing sides or one where 90% of the viewers agree?
I don’t think it’s possible for 90% to agree, Army. After the Morgansect, I’m guessing at least 15 or 20% agree with your original assessment and want Morgan dead. 😉
http://www.spoilertv.com/2011/12/poll-what-did-you-think-of-chuck-chuck_31.html
Almost 94% “great” or “awesome” for Baby. I’d call that a consensus. After all, it was a sample from a whole 0.008% of the estimated viewing audience.
Jeff true! then again if you look at the greatness that was foretold for a few episodes, baby and push mix come to mind neither one lived up to the hype (in general terms based on fan reactions from multiple sites) so maybe this one will exceed it. i’m not saying the ep’s were bad just they didn’t live up to the hype.
Jeff and here you said you can’t get 90% to agree, lol. i can’t argue with with a pole. go to CI, chuckgasmic or geekfurios and read the reviews or replies about baby. you’ll find it different from the the pole.
My list is very similar to yours, Uplink, with one major exception. Here’s my ranking of finales. I exclude Marlin, because it wasn’t planned to be one, even though it was a really excellent one by accident. I exclude it because I’m ranking episodes that TPTB planned to be epic and worthy of finale epic-ness.
1. Cliffhanger
2. Push Mix
3. Ring
4. Ring 2
5. Other Guy
I wouldn’t be surprised if 10 of those whopping 242 voters would changed their vote it Baby was the actual finale and Morgan was still breathing. That would push it below 90%. (In case anyone’s sarcasm detector is off, it’s been there for my last three posts.)
My point about spoilertv, this site, I assume the other sites you mentioned, and maybe chucktv.net and nbc’s boards, is they are all too small of a sample to know what “people” really thought of Baby. When people really like or really hate something in a show, they tend to gravitate towards sites where the moderators have many of the same views. I assume that’s what happened at those other sites. That’s probably why I am hanging out here this season. Also, one thing I appreciate about this site is I can still debate with you about Baby, or disagree to some extent with most everyone else about S3.0 (except maybe Ernie), or disagree with Ernie about Duck, and it stays civil.
Shocking but true, I agree with Thinkling’s list! I’d add, I’ve actually liked every one of those finales, but none of them rank as a “season’s best” for me.
Dave, I certainly agree about the finales not being season #1 favorite, especially for S2 and S3. Cliffhanger and Push Mix have higher season rankings than the others, though.
In regards to the use of the word, “satisfying” to describe the ending, I think its a matter of the people on the show being afraid to over-promise. If they came out saying that the ending is going to blow people away, I think it would be dangerous because you know there would be some people who would expect something no one can deliver.
Oh yeah, I agree with that Thinkling. Other Guy gets a proportionally high rating too, but that’s more because of how low I rank the rest of the season!
I’d also add that I normally do count Marlin because I believe was intended as a mid-season finale from the start. As such I think I’d rank it third on your list, maybe even second. And I’d rank it as my third favorite episode of S1, right after Pilot and Tango.
Although they’ve certainly made big promises before DKD. Remember Push Mix was supposed to be the “best 15 minutes of Chuck ever!” And I think most of us felt it was pretty good, but not “…best ever…”
Of course it may just mean Yvonne is a little more prudent in her word choice than Schwedak!
Jeff i agree. most blogs tend to favor one fan type to another. some lean heavy to the i’ll take anything they give us and enjoy it, to the i’ll nit pick it to death. that’s why i find polls conducted on blogs questionable. one it’s to small a sample as you said, two as dave says only hard core fans post so it really doesn’t give a true reading of the casual fan and three depending on what the general opinion of the blog is the votes tend to sway that way.
All I know is that the finale could make or break the show for me. If it’s good? Bring on the rewatches. If it’s not… well, a one way trip to the Shift + Delete button is the way my (120+ Gigabytes) folder will go.
I do find it interesting that the episode that seemed to in many respects have the biggest likelihood of being the series finale, thank you Jay Leno, Other Guy seems to fall further and further down the list. How Sepinwall ever said it would have been a satisfying finale is beyond me. There are more plot holes and weak performances in that single episode than in practically all of season 2.
Ernie, I don’t know if it’s possible to do a ranking poll, and maybe this should wait until after the finale, but I could see several questions:
1) Best finale moment: “Save me later”, Bracelet, Sarah choosing Chuck at Woodcomb wedding, “You saved me” or “Yes”, “That’s what makes him great”, Proposal, Wedding, ???
2) Best finale twist: Casey will eliminate Chuck when new Intersect comes online, Sarah shoots Mauser in cold blood and lies about it, Intersect 2.0, none, Orion Cave and Mary, none, Morgansect, ???
3) Best finale villain: Pita girl, Mauser & Ned, Roarke, Shaw/Director, Shaw again, A. Volkoff, V. Volkoff, Nicholas Quinn
4) Best finale mission/action: Stealing the Buy More, Hostages at the Buy More, Wedding ambush, Rescue Sarah twice, Take down the Ring Elders, Take down Volkoff and Hydra, Save Sarah, ???
5) Best finale overall: Marlin, Santa Claus, Ring, Other Guy, Ring 2, Push Mix, Cliffhanger, Goodbye
I was thinking like this because Push Mix, for example, would be lower for me overall, but the proposal moment is at or near the top. The stealing the Buy More “mission” might be my favorite of the series because it was so absurdly funny.
“Vs the Other Guy” only looks good because the whole S3 before it was awful. I certainly wouldn’t have found it satisfying as a series finale, too little too late.
Still, I don’t hate it, it was the first S3 episode that left me smiling and it guided Chuck back to happier times.
Aerox I do agree the finale has the potential to undo the entire series (as I’ve outlined earlier, basically any major Charah malfunction). This potential exists on any show. Killing off a beloved character will ruin any show’s posterity to me. As would a “Newhart” ending for anything other than a pure comedy (didn’t some hospital drama, like St. Elsewhere or something, do that?)
But at this point I don’t expect that. I expect the series to live long and fondly in my memory.
@Uplink: Agreed on OG. Mosty for me it would have been WAY too little return on investment. Now Honeymooners, though not intended as such, would have been the way to end Chuck at that point. But I’m glad it didn’t end of course.
Dave, I think Yvonne is much more prudent with her words, too, and does far better interviews than Schwedak, probably because she understands/identifies/sympathizes with the fans and comes across as very simpatico, while Schwedak do not. Schwartz promised that fans of all the characters would be satisfied. Yet, I haven’t heard anyone say best ever or most epic or anything like that. (Apropos of nothing, I loved her gentle jab at NBC.)
Then, too, satisfying means slightly different things to different people.
Jeff you just helped me point out what i was trying to say, so thanks. you said, “I was thinking like this because Push Mix, for example, would be lower for me overall, but the proposal moment is at or near the top.”
that’s my concern about the finale (i’m lumping 12-13 together since it will air the same night). that most of it is not very good or only good and the final moments elevate it way up. in other words like you said about push mix if you take away the hallway scene is the episode really as good or rate as high?
Yeah Thinkling I think that the subjective nature of “satisfying” is where a lot of fan anxiety lies. I mean it doesn’t really say much of anything, and it’s not even impossible to imagine her grasping that word if she mostly wasn’t happy with the ending but needed to say something that wouldn’t get her trouble professionally! Although hope she would have used a code word more like “interesting” in that case…
But I actually do have some confidence in Schwedak to deliver a good finale at this point so I’m willing to look for positive interpretations of all remarks.
Dave, that was St Elsewhere. A show my wife absolutely loved. I liked it a lot too. The finale sucked. The entire series was just an illusion in an autistic kid’s mind while looking at a snowglobe. Horrible ending for a fantastic series.
And you know the funny thing is Uplink, don’t think I’ve ever heard anyone really defend that ending. You’d think at this point writers would have a better clue on what constitutes a good ending that fans will appreciate, and yet it seems every year one fandom or another is screaming bloody murder about the horrible send off their show got. (most aren’t as universally reviled as the St Elsewhere ending though!)
Maybe it’s in the screenwriters guild rules somewhere that a certain number of series have to totally pooch their ending so fans will be that more excited for the shows that end well…
Dave one thing to keep in mind about how a show ends is for most of them it’s a sudden thing. in the scheme of TV most shows don’t get the chance for a proper send off like chuck is getting. i can only recall about 10 shows that i watched that went into their final season knowing it was their last. for the most part they ended well or satisfying but i felt should have been better. JAG was the weakest of them all but they were hampered by a possible spin off that was suppose to air the next season.
Army I was speaking purely of shows that know their end. I never hold a weak or non- ending against a show that was yanked without warning. (I may hold it against a network or studio exec but not the show runner!). And I do follow entertainment news enough to know which is which.
Dave, sorry i wasn’t clear or maybe what you said was unclear to me. you were referring to fandoms not specific shows like chuck. each year when a show gets axed people yell about how bad it ended, most have no clue how things work. that said i was not talking about you.
Army, I think in JAG they tried to follow a Law & Order/ER template by changing the cast (possible into that spin-off), but the new cast wasn’t likeable. They knew they were ending the Harm/Mac story, but they just chickened out and left a coin flip in the air.
So far, no one was said the Chuck ending is ambiguous, like JAG or the Sopranos.
Okay your right army, I wasn’t clear; but I really wasn’t even considering shows that were yanked without warning. I suppose marginal shows could get their own category; and that’s something I’ve always appreciated about the show runners for Chuck that they’ve made an effort to give us a mostly acceptable finale each of those times they thought it might be the end.
JAG was a pretty lousy ending. But JAG did have the advantage of being mostly a procedural, well that and the central relationship had been pounded into oblivion such that I completely didn’t care by the end.
Interesting thing though; NCIS is from the same show runner. Do you think the very different handling of that show is a product of lessons learned from JAG? In particular, the complete lack of anything between Tony and Ziva until fairly recently almost makes me think the writer decided to do no romance at all until goaded into it by a fairly vocal Tiva ‘shipper faction of the audience. And now that there has been some small movement in that relationship, will he develop the story or just tease it indefinitely. Given the show’s ratings its likely to remain on the air forever (unless Gibbs/Mark Harmnon’s eventual retirement forces an end), so at some pooint decisions will have to made about it. I guess detached enough on that one its more of an interesting case study to me thhan anything else.
Before anyone else jumps in I will have to acknowledge some different external issues there too. First was the departure of Kate/Sasha Alexander, which was likely the original intended romantic interest for Tony. And second was Mark Harmon demanding the replacement of the original executiive producer several seasons back; I don’t know what impact that may have had on story lines and character development.
For me, the best JAG (and NCIS) episodes were the non-procedural ones. They did more with the relationships and often featured spies, assassinations, or arms deals… in other words, they were more like Chuck.
I think NCIS ignoring the relationships has made me lose interest. Although it’s hard not to see some episodes when it’s on USA all of the time. I wonder if CBS has a better plan for the end of NCIS than NBC did when L&O and ER dwindled.
Jeff JAG knew it was ending was supposed to have a new series called JAG San Diego. it was going to move the remaining cast out west, they even promoted it. they finished the scripts for the final season still in negotiations with DJE to move with the cast. from what i have read the ending was for two reason’s if they got him then Mac won the toss and he decided to go and they get married, if they couldn’t Mac won the toss and he decided not to follow but DJE would be open for guest spots. they couldn’t end it any other way because of the new show that was supposed to follow it.
Dave. i think your right about NCIS, TPTB learned their lesson real quick after JAG. i don’t think they will go that route unless they go at it hard and fast, again lesson learned.
just my opinion but i feel the wt/wt theme will end soon for most shows. it’s not the same as the past when there was no internet. i’m not a shipper as you know but i can see the affects already on some shows. castle is pretty much the same show it was with no real change in quality with the cases. what has changed is the relationship. the longer it goes unresolved the more viewers seem to be leaving. people just get tired of it i think.
Jeff I’m exactly the opposite on NCIS, I prefer the more stand alone episodes. I enjoy the banter and interaction of the cast and I always love a good mystery, but I’m VERY cynical about the intent to show any actual relationship development. I almost wish they’d just leave it alone. I’m okay assuming the characters have a good working relationship, but personal relationships that are totally off-screen.
Now that said, I think it would be funny to try to work a show like that and then have a reveal three or four seasons in that two of the main characters are happily married and have been since long before the show started. I’m sort of inspired for that by a former Air Traffic Manager of mine who was “involved” with a union rep. We all knew it but it wasn’t discussed. Until AFTER she retired, then my manager happily mentioned HIS WIFE every opportunity he could. None of knew when THAT happened. Obviously to work on screen the show couldn’t be character driven or that sort of detail would have to come up quickly. But it would be fun in a procedural to keep it in the background for a long while.
Army that might be an awesome contribution of the Internet if it shortens wt/wt cycles on TV shows! I rarely ‘ship like I have on Chuck; but I pretty much always find prolonged “romantic tension” to be a drain. I don’t really watch soap operas. I don’t want to see all the messy relationship details. Now if two characters on screen have a good chemistry I’m perfectly happy to see them get together; in fact, that may not be strong enough, I really like when that happens. But I don’t want most shows to be ABOUT the relationship.
I think we’ve heard more comments recently from the show runner on Castle that the wt/wt is indeed coming to an end there soon. While that one never affected me like Chuck and Sarah, I’d still say its gone on a beat too long and I’ll be happy to see them try something new!
Dave i too have seen the comments TPTB have made. the latest one has both secrets coming out at the worst possible time. when he was asked why he replied that he likes to tease the viewers with the relationship. bad move on his part because it was all over the castle sites. again the internet spreads dumb statements quickly. for the shows sake i hope it ends soon or it will end the show, lol. sound familiar?
Interesting, Army. I thought the JAG San Diego idea was thrown out a lot earlier.
Castle’s ratings increased in S3 and have been relatively steady after the predictable S3 cliffhanger resolution bump. For some reason, Castle viewers are significantly more patient than Chuck viewers. But I agree there is a risk of people jumping ship.
Funny story, Dave. I’ve seen a lot of Castle fans make statements that Castle and Beckett are “already married” despite evidence to the contrary on the show. There’s also a lot of Stargate fanfics that have Carter having a secret (illegal) affair with her CO, O’Neill. I can remember one SG fic an inprogress Castle fic in which the main couple was legally married before the first episode, but only they knew it.
Jeff during season 10 they had an episode called JAG San Diego, it was supposed to be the launch point for the spin off if they went that direction. as we know they didn’t.
as for castle, the second week was a 3.1 the last episode was a 2.3, that’s a big drop off. also the total viewer numbers went from 13 to just over 8 mil.
hmmmm, perhaps Chuck fans aren’t the only ones who tire of prolonged teasing….
I was looking at: http://tvseriesfinale.com/tv-show/castle-ratings-2011-2012/
The 3.2 premiere was the 2nd best ever, so the 3.1 was probably 3rd all-time or close to it. It’s not a good idea to judge trends from outliers.
The last episode was up from the previous 2 episodes, although it’s hard to judge against the BCS championship (which might hurt or might be the same as MNF) and a Hawaii 5-0 rerun (which definitely helped). The previous episode was skewed by a lack of DWTS lead-in and layoff. I think a portion of Castle’s ratings are dependent on DWTS or the Bachelor as lead-ins, so it’s hard to tell if the story line has any effect. Chuck’s ratings had competition issues, but never lead-in issues.
Jeff exactly. there are huge reasons why shows lose viewers but in this case i think the wt/wt is working against them. the first part of the season showed a decline as well and still had DWTS as a lead in.
i have said for 2 years now that ratings can tell a story about the show. i claimed that the reason people left was they didn’t like the show as much. i was pretty much killed for it when talking about chuck. but a poll ernie did helped my position. the last poll he did with ranking the eps on a scale of 1-5, you know the one. anywho the seasons ended up 2, 4 and 3. 2 lost the fewest viewers, then 4 and then 3. is that just coincidence or does it help my point?
with castle the thing that has changed the most is the dragging on of the wt/wt. like dave said maybe they are tired of it too like chuck fans?
Army I think a major problem in drawing a conclusion from a poll like one of ours is that its done after the fact. So everyone rating the episodes is still here. The folks who left can no longer speak for themselves. We can make some educated (or totally wild!) guesses, but conclusions are tricky.
Now that said, I do believe the change of tone twice was a problem. When the show went darker in S3 it chased off a lot of viewers. When it switched back in S4; well the folks who liked S3 the most didn’t seem to like S4 much. I can only guess that many viewers who left in S3 would have loved S4. I only know that to be true in the four cases of people I brought back; which is way to small to be statistically valid. But it is 100% in this case so I am fairly confident of it; even if it only PROVES that people I recruited to the show in the first place have similar taste to mine.
Dave, very true and i agree. my point was rather simple i think. the people still here enjoyed the show and they showed which season they liked more than others. granted it is not perfect and may include guesses but as you said the change in the show did have an affect on the viewership, but isn’t that similar? people didn’t like the new direction and left? they didn’t like the character assassination and PLI’s OLI’s in season 3 they left?
you are right however no actual conclusions can be drawn just a more educated guess on my part using the poll.
The story is always a factor, but I think there are other factors as well.
One thing that always bugs me about S3 ratings conclusions is when people use the first three episodes. The first two were on Sunday against different competition, and the third was the very next night, benefiting from carry-over of the “3 episode special event premiere”. The ratings of those three episodes had nothing to do with the plot. All of the same conclusions from the 4th episode to the 13th or the 4th to 19th still apply, but the statistics are not as drastic. Monday night, non-special event Chuck dropped from a 2.5 to a 1.8 (still big), but not a 3.0 to a 1.8.
The odd thing is the biggest “regular” drop was after Beard, which was one of the better liked S3.0 episodes (at least, as Dave said, by the people who remained here.) But that could have been because of a HIMYM rerun during Beard and a new episode the next week.
Jeff very true. it should be noted that 2 eps later they rebounded to 2.1 again and remained at 2.1 for three eps until honeymooners where the ep following it dropped to 1.9 and just kept going. that one i don’t understand as good as it was. guess fans are finicky.
http://www.tvguide.com/News/MegaBuzz-Castle-Greys-House-1041420.aspx
Hmm… a riddle, eh? What can be taken, that’s not physical, but its loss can be considered tragic?
Their marriage? Normal life?
By removing his supressed intersect his memories of his relationship with Sarah? They are out of the spy business and the show ends with him working at the Nerd Herd desk and her coming in for him?
That would be something, herder. I’m not sure if I like that idea or not. I’m still wrapping my head around the idea. It would be a little tragic, but still could be a hopeful and positive ending if done right.
The Wienerlicious scenes have to fit somehow. Maybe his memories disappearing or maybe them trying to restore them.
Memories is an interesting idea. It gets some traction with the whole “everything he’s built in five years” line. But my bet is they wouldn’t end on the down beat, we would know Sarah was with him and they were rebuilding their lives. And in the end, Sarah might be just fine with Chuck forgetting his time in the spy world.
I was thinking something alone the lines of them being together is destiny not circumstances. It could also end something like the pilot, with the two of them on the beach and her saying “trust me, we’re meant to be together”.
thats close to my dallas/newhart ending, chuck wakes up after an injury and he is already married to sarah with kids. the entire thing was just a dream that never happened. he and sarah have always been normal people.
Noooooo. I’m not sure about a memory loss for one of them. The other would make sure they got their happily ever after, maybe by telling the other the story of how they got together. The five seasons still would have happened.
But I really, really hope it’s not a Dallas/Newhart thing. I hate episodes of shows that never happen and don’t have consequences.
I can’t imagine them going so far as to make the whole thing a dream. One or the other (probably Chuck) loosing memories could work, but making it all a fantasy seems too much.
Dave, Jeff…exactly! not what people would expect. she said almost the same thing right?
Army, in our Baby debates, I sometimes wondered if you were messing with us, but in inspired me to write two fanfics, so that’s ok. This time, I know you are messing with us, so I’m stepping away… from… the… keyboard… now–
Jeff, actually i’m not messing with you. while i don’t think it will turn out that way why eliminate any possibility? this show has been known to bend the rules a lot. think of it this way. there is a lot going to happen in the last 4 episodes. i don’t think they can wrap up all the loose ends they have out there now even if they took two hours to do it. they are also very fond of using other peoples ideas. this type of ending while fairly cheap allows them to do just that. even if they kill someone when he wakes up they aren’t dead.
like i said i really don’t think it will go down this way it’s an off the wall ending. as you pointed out in our baby discussion with enough work anything is possible despite what has been show over the course of the show.
my biggest fear for the ending is they make it fanfiction like. sarah fakes her death to protect chuck then they flash forward a few years and she comes back and all is well or something crazy like that. any type of ending is possible at this point so it really is all just in fun.
interesting, many variations of the same statement. just a guess but adding the synopsis, “from destroying everything Chuck has built over the past five years.” with not physical could be the business or his relationship.
You guys are missing the obvious. Chuck constantly uses movies and TV as a source for it’s themes and plots, and it was even hinted at in season 2. He takes Chuck’s mojo.
No big deal. Mystlynx even wrote a chapter about Chuck loosing, regaining, and loosing his mojo in Mystlynx vs the Chuck Me Mondays Challenge: http://www.fanfiction.net/s/5136770/19/
http://insidetv.ew.com/2012/01/11/chuck-star-yvonne-strahovski-chuck-and-sarah-will-have-something-taken-away-from-them-in-final-episodes/
[QUOTE]
“Something very unexpected happens,” she says. “When I read the script, I was really surprised myself. Chuck and Sarah have this great relationship, but I think in these last episodes, you’ll see that they’ll have something taken away from them, and it sort of causes some trouble in a big way.”
[/QUOTE]
I know! In the spirit of Subway, Toyota, and Apple, the final arc is all about product placement. It’s about identity theft. It’s an ad for LifeLock. After their experience, Chuck and Sarah convert Carmichael Industries into the “enforcement” team for LifeLock. 🙂
i have to wonder with all these tidbits coming out along with others that say it’s not physical (their loss) could it be chuck’s innocence in the spy world? his doing something he’s never had to do before and it affects them both?
that was the S3 story. I don’t believe they’ll revisit that.
To think all this fighting for Fedak’s show. How he repays the fans. Screwing with Chuck and Sarah again and a quick resolution.
Ugh!
Well RAC some of this is just the nature of action/adventure. As long as Chuck and Sarah are fighting to be together and do end together I’d call it a win. Even if one or both of them is a bit jerky about something for a little bit (5.12?) it doesn’t need to be a very big deal. They’ve given us a lot of beautiful moments these last couple seasons. To me, the bottom line is just if they don’t ruin what came before I think I’ll be mostly happy with it (“happy with it” not being the same as calling it an all time favorite episode!).
This is sort of a funny conversation for me. Most of my life I’ve been a big action/adventure guy. But now, with this show, its my love of the characters that drives my passion. So while a big action send-off may be a lot of fun, its Chuck and Sarah happy together that means the most to me. And I”m sure we’ll get that. My only quibble is a style issue. I want a warm happy send off for my favorite couple, and here I’m feeling a little disappointed that the end may be all action/adventure!
One thing I haven’t seen brought up, is their whole ability to have kids. I know, arguably that is a physical thing to have taken away. But keep in mind, we’re getting these clues from interviews with one person; its always possible her word choice is not perfect. I think something involving mind control and memories seems most consistant with what she’s said. But having kids has been such a huge theme these last couple weeks, they’re either foreshadowing or setting up the tragedy.
Dave, i’m sure they can go the route of she/he can’t have kids so i failed as a human and now i can’t be with you or now you don’t want me anymore. that seems to be along with the miscarriage what a lot of people have latched onto. i’m trying to look outside the box. these guys do have a past of working outside the box. my big fear is they do go a very emotional route then wrap it up in the final few minutes.
the whole miscarriage idea reminds me of malamoos second chance. not exactly mind you but in general. since i didn’t really enjoy that one i am staying away from that idea.
Dave, you even replied to that idea when I posted it above: https://chuckthisblog.wordpress.com/spoilers/the-last-s5-spoiler-page-youll-ever-need/#comment-60656
Has someone done the Intersect brain melting thing on you?
Army I think we’ve been all over miscarriage as a possibility, I meant actual ability to have kids. That could easily tie into a fight for one’s future.
I have no idea HOW such a thing would play out, but I’m also just trying to explore possibilities.
And I think its a forgone conclusion that it will be an action packed episode with little or no proper denouement. So there’s likely to be A LOT of unanswered questions and loose ends when the dust settles. I believe I commented a couple weeks ago that I hoped that wouldn’t be the case; but it is, as others have mentioned, Fedak’s modus operendi.
Jeff, geez you expect me to remember something from two DAYS ago! Yeah you probably are the one who planted the idea in my head, but I’ve been kicking it around again after reading today’s interviews. It’s seeming more plausible to me now than it did then.
After forgetting Army’s Manchurian Candidate theory (although I was thinking more of a Volkoff thing), I couldn’t help myself. As long as you still know who Indiana Jones is, it’s ok.
Indiana’s the dog, right?
i think he’s the guy whole lives in Indianapolis and sells pretzels on the corner.
Another interview:
http://insidetv.ew.com/2012/01/11/chuck-star-yvonne-strahovski-chuck-and-sarah-will-have-something-taken-away-from-them-in-final-episodes/
I wonder if TPTB are twirling their mustaches at her spoilers or if they are panicking and calling her after each one to clarify a different way.
Best quote: “it’s one of the greatest feelings in the world to be able to wrap up a show knowing that you sort of created a mini-nerd empire.” So which one of the principals here is the regional governor of this part of the empire?
Oops, same article as ChipLecsap. Sorry.
Joe is, but I believe he prefers “Tetrarch”.
You do raise an interesting question Jeff; I wonder if Yvonne is getting any direction on her remarks? I’m sure they received some guidlines before they broke production. But at this point I think its a “former job.” There may be some contractual stipulations about what can be said when. But I’ve kind of been treating Yvonne’s interviews like she’s speaking off the cuff. If she’s getting phone calls or long text messages from Fedak after each interview, well that would be sort of funny.
Yeah, Dave, I get the feeling this is Yvonne unplugged, while still respectful of contractual stipulations and non spoiler guidelines. I’m really glad for her interviews, and I really liked the one just above.
Which always brings us back to the question of why wasn’t she out there more often?!
Pretty sad if it just means SoBe has a better idea how to promote a personality and product than a studio and TV network do. I mean how many times SHOULD Yvonne have been on Leno or the Today show during the last five years?! Oh never mind; I’m taking deep breaths and thinking happy thoughts now…
I’ve been thinking a similar thing. SoBe has helped with more Chuck promotion this week than NBC has done most weeks for the last few years. If the SI swimsuit issue was last year, Chuck might not be on Fridays.
My mom made an observation last weekend (after saying she wanted to tell Greenblatt off because the Nielsens are a ‘load of crap’). She said she didn’t know why actors who play Chuck and Sarah were not on any of the daytime shows promoting Chuck. My parents might be outside of the key Nielsen demographic, but they purchased the DVDs. I’m the only reason they know Chuck exists. On the morning shows, Yvonne would’ve been welcomed because she played a strong female role. On the night shows, Yvonne would be welcomed because she models. Zac was on the tonight show a couple of times, but he probably could have sub-hosted shows like that Regis show.
Tetrarch! [snort!]
You come right here and clean the Pepsie off my monitor now! 😉
interesting thought jeff. my personal thought is similar to what happened above with dave. she has given so many interviews over the last few days she can’t remember exactly what she says from one to another. i also believe she may have gotten a few calls as well.
Chuck vs Bo sneak peek #1 (although it seems to be #2): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRWeuh_OXcY
SO MUCH SYNCHRONIZED SIPPING!!!
Thanks! i always see new promo’s listed as number one. i wonder if they don’t count the one that airs after the show? making this new sneak peak 1? it happens with castle sneak peaks all the time. like the one that airs after the show is considered the promo but these are considered sneak peaks?
It was posted on youtube several hours ago and is the only one on nbc.com right now, making it #1. However it seems to be chronologically before the other one.
A theory about Jeff and Lester continuing their mission: Morgan used twilight darts, so they don’t remember, making them suspicious. If Team B is kicking the creepy cousin, they might be shopping the store around to sell, leading Jeff and Lester to try to figure out who is selling the store. Really crazy theory: Jeff’s mom stole a bunch of money before she was put in jail. Smart Jeff remembers where it is and buys the story in the final episode.
I had a thought about this, Jeff. Right after Morgan tranq’d them, Chuck said that they “have a problem.” I think that wouldn’t be the case if they had used those “twilight” tranqs (which would have been suspiciously convenient for this situation).
My (slight) worry is that “the problem” will be left on the floor. We’ve accused TPTB of doing that before. – mostly rightly, too.
Oh that would be a hoot to see Jeff (and Lester) owning the store! But I guess we’ll never actually see it. Sigh…
Chuck vs Bo sneak peek #2 (although it seems to be before #1). The second video on:
http://www.spoilertv.com/2012/01/chuck-episode-510-chuck-versus-bo-2.html
I haven’t found a youtube link, so hopefully this is not regionally blocked.
Here’s the youtube link, in case the above is regionally blocked, however this one is only 240p: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-aoWLJgHCnc
chucktv.net has a higher quality embedded vids (with ads) from nbc: http://chucktv.net/2012/01/11/videos-2-new-sneak-peeks-at-chuck-vs-bo/
Who would have thought that Sarah wants to quit the spy life first.
As for the Chuck vs Sarah conflict. Sigh!
I think Chuck was 1st (Helicopter), 2nd (Predator), and 3rd (Colonel – probably more, but I’m rounding down), Sarah was 4th (Ring) but Chuck didn’t know it until the Pink Slip flashback, Chuck was 5th (Pink Slip flashback) and 6th (American Hero), Sarah was 7th (Honeymooners), Chuck was 8th (Ring 2) and 9th (Cliffhanger), and Sarah was 10th (when she woke in Cliffhanger), meaning this time Sarah is 11th.
Chuck still has a higher count, but the only time they are on the same page is when she initiates it (Pink Slip flashback and Bo) or she is unconscious (Cliffhanger).
LOL. Good recap.
So we’ve seen the return of the Wienerlicious and I’ve been wracking my brain on trying to get this included (considering the fact we’ve seen the polka dots on Yvonne’s skirt and the managers uniform that Zachary was wearing) and there are a few things I thought of.
– It’s a cover. The problem with this? Well, how would they possibly integrate this in the storyline? Considering it was demolished for the Orange Orange and all.
– Newhart ending. Chuck wakes up and finds that he and Sarah work in food service, she as a cook and he as the manager. The problem with this? Crappy ending.
Anyone else wants to chip in?
that was one of the things that lead to my spec of the newhart ending. how else could they work it in since as far as we know chuck never worked there.
I’ve always assumed it was demolished, but maybe that is not the case. The geography of the Buy More Plaza is a little iffy. At various points of time, there’s been Buy More, Large Mart, Underpants Etc., Sbarro, Subway, Lou’s Deli, the spy shop, Orange Orange, Burlington Coat Factory, and Wienerlicious.
Underpants, Etc. and Large Mart are left of the Buy More: http://chucktv.net/gallery/albums/screencaps_season1/screencaps_102_1/Chuck_102_0017.jpg
Lou’s was within visual distance of the Wienerlicious.
The Wienerlicious is/was across the parking lot and an access street with a stop sign:
http://chucktv.net/gallery/displayimage.php?pid=93719&fullsize=1
http://chucktv.net/gallery/displayimage.php?album=170&pid=93714#top_display_media
http://chucktv.net/gallery/displayimage.php?album=170&pid=93716#top_display_media
http://chucktv.net/gallery/displayimage.php?pid=30937&fullsize=1
The walls to the right of the Wienerlicious and Orange Orange imply that they were the same building. However, the bush in front of that right wall is new (new landscaping?), the tree looks new (the camera angle?), and the road is either different (resurfaced?). I also don’t remember the Burlington Coat Factory next to the Wienerlicious.
The red awnings on the building to the right looks like the Wienerlicious, not the Orange Orange. Then again, that looks like a WalMart to the left, not a LargeMart.
We were never told it was demolished. Maybe some of the woman at the Sarah’s bachelorette party are still working there.
Missing a pic from Predator: http://chucktv.net/gallery/displayimage.php?pid=63632&fullsize=1
which will make more sense when my reference heavy post is moderated. 😉
I’d always assumed Orange Orange just took the slot, I don’t see anything there to definitely refute that. If the OO was just a government cover business, perhaps the Bartowski’s re-open Weinerlicious as part of their burgeoning retail empire.
I don’t know, I still think cover of some sort. I’m not sure if this can be deciphered until we actually see it.
I think most people thought that, because Chuck says in First Date, “I miss the Wienerlicious.” But they never say it is destroyed. It could have been foreclosed and left empty. Or if Chuck simply meant he missed seeing Sarah at the Wienerlicious, which is still open next door, he probably would have said the same thing. He was trying to build up the nerve to ask Sarah out.
We don’t know if the Orange Orange building is still standing either.
I’m thinking it’s a flashback (which might have a lot of people screaming “retcon!”)
Flashback was my first thought too, but when did Chuck ever work there? As you say, if they do that, it invites screams of retcon. Even though we have an indefinite unknown period between 1.13 and 2.01.
If the Weinerlicious is a separate site they could be undercover there. Even better, if its a chain they could be somewhere entirely different from the Buy More plaza (Chuck and Sarah undercover anywhere nearby is likely asking for trouble. Probably half the mall knows the nerd and his hot wife!)
Was Chuck wearing a Wienerlicious vest in one of the pics? I must have missed that.
yes he was.
Link to these pics?
A googling we will go…
Somewhere, there’s other pics inside the Wienerlicious and of them loading the sign on a truck, probably on other twitters for cast and crew members.
“Anyone else wants to chip in?”
Given that Yvonne’s stunt double was involved in the Weinerlicious scenes, I’m going to guess it’s part of the mission and not the denouement. There was a mention that part of the finale takes place in Germany and the Riviera. Maybe the original Weinerlicious chain is in Germany. That street in the picture looks like it could be made up to be European.
Ohhhhh DKD that’s it! Austria though (Vienna maybe?), where else would Weinerlicious have started?! That or its the perfect place for delusional Americans to try to expand to. (like a Taco Bell in Mexico City!) Perfect.
Simple explanation: It’s a flashback scene. Chuck is not in it, but was on set that day digging through old props and costumes. Everyone went out for drinks after shooting, and Zac thought it would be funny to wear Scooter’s vest.
Well, maybe that’s not so simple.
Why is everyone down on fast food? McDonalds’ stock was up over 35% for the last year in a bad economy. They did better than Carmichael Industries did. 🙂
I think you hit it dkd. It may very well be cover, but for a mission in Germany or Austria … somewhere Bavarian. I certainly like that spec the best. It’s the perfect combination of nostalgia and international espionage. If that’s true and Sarah is involved, that seems like a good sign, too. Well done. 🙂
Hey I love fast food. But I think it constitutes a “guilty pleasure”. I mean look at my Gravatar, do you think I get enough french fries???
I just love the idea of trying to run a quasi-Bavarian/American restaraunt in an actual germanic country. Unless its at an American military base I think its a doomed proposition! But I think on Chuck, deciding the Weinerlicious truly is foreign makes perfect sense…
I love it that our obsessive nerdiness knows no bounds. If you find the BuyMore plaza geography confusing you can look at the actual plaza they filmed at here. There is also information on it and Chuck’s apartment complex here. My sense was that the O-O just took over the Weinerliscious location. According to some of the show crew most of the exterior shots used the actual location shots with visual effects to add the signs like Buy More and Underpants Etc. There was an actual Weinerliscious sign, and I believe they did some location shoots in season 1&2 where they would dress up some of the buildings for the day, like the one of the Weinerliscious Jeff linked to above.
I don’t know if anyone posted this picture:
http://www.celebritytweet.com/link.php?s=http://t.co/lmCD46d7
Chuck and Sarah leave the spy and electronics biz for the fast food industry?
wow talk about a let down of an ending, but hey why not. one guess is as good as another.
Yeah I think the cover thing is most likely the case with the Wienerlicious especially with the sneak peek and Casey suggesting they drop the Buy More, and you guys are right it was never determined what happened to the Wienerlicious after Sarah took up the cover in the OO – perhaps it is still there.
Hey what else does Sarah have on her resume that she could actually show to an employer lol? Chuck only has the BuyMore and let’s face it if I was interviewing Chuck and saw a Stanford grad who had spent 10 years working at the BuyMore I would have serious doubts about hiring him lol.
In real life, I believe former CIA employees CAN say they worked for the CIA after they left.
Interviewer: “I see here you worked for the CIA for many years. I bet that was interesting. So were you an analyst?”
Sarah: “No.”
Interviewer: “Oh. Um… So it’s one of those ‘if I told you I’d have to kill you things’?”
Sarah [cold stare]: “Exactly.”
Interviewer: [gulp] “Ah, I see you have knife throwing, several martial arts, small firearms, bomb defusing, intimidation, and seduction listed as skills.”
Sarah: [pleasant, but still scarey smile]
Interviewer [pulls at collar]: “Well… Do you have any references?”
Sarah: “I don’t think you have the clearance to speak to them.”
Interviewer [forced smile]: “Ok, then. Thank you for your time. I have your number. We’ll let you know when we make a decision.”
Sarah: “Thank you. And don’t worry if you can’t reach me. I know where you live.”
Jeff, ROTFL
I think Jeff just pre viewed his next fanfic.
The one I wanted to see is the two of them applying for a mortgage after Chuck took that signing bonus for rejoining the CIA for the down payment. How do you explain 49 Million in frozen assetts, your own private jet and sattelite, a retail electronics outlet and a job history that includes two fast food resturants on her side and a decade in retail electronics on his.
Jeff that was perfect! Part of what’s so much fun about Sarah is trying to insert her into normal(ish) situations.
Although she does have some skills she could likely use, and not just fast food service! Her foreign language ability is formidable; seriously, she could likely land a very good job with any number of international concerns. And I don’t even mean travel, more like translating at a consulate or for any business with ties to Russia, or Poland, or Germany, or France, or Hungary, or Thailand (okay, scratch that, she may make many Thai people very nervous…).
Quasi-officially she has a degree from Harvard, we don’t know what in (probably something involving international studies or law) but that would surely open some opportunities to her all by itself.
Jeff, you forgot ballroom dancing, pickpocketing, high speed pursuit, safecracking, runway modeling, electronic surveilance, lockpicking, mountaineering and bellydancing under skills. Well the last one was private I suppose. She also makes a mean potato salad and a pretty decent omlet.
Lets see, languages Sarah has spoken. There’s Polish, German, Hungarian, Russian and Thai. At least those are the only ones I can think of off the top of my head.
She has spoken Spanish, and translated French (The Ex) and Swedish too.
Thanks, everyone. I knew the skill list was lacking, but you all have provided great additions. Or she could just put, “My husband says I can do anything, and he’s right. I can.”
I was thinking about the fanfic idea for the interview, but I really need to finish my in progress story first. The whole thing is in my head, I just need the time to write and edit 8-12K words (which will probably grow to 15K).
The city they’re going to is Berlin AFAIK. At least that’s what the baddie of the week posted on his facebook account. And unless the writers have never ever been there, it’s really a bad business plan to put a wienerlicious there. Then again, CI blew through 870 million dollars in 6 months so maybe the writers just like terrible business plans.
Which makes it perfect for Chuck!
The important thing about a cover store, is to make it a place no one wants to be. The Orange Orange had nasty yogurt and the Wienerlicious had Sarah’s burnt deep fried food–both of which helped offset the fact Sarah herself would bring in the teenage boy crowd. The Buy More had Jeff and Lester to scare everyone away. That makes the Wienerlicious a good cover for whatever the mission is. There can’t be any innocent bystanders when the big fight goes down.
Where’d you get the terrible yogurt? Sure, there wasn’t a huge crowd, but according to First Date, business seemed rather okay. Plus… the way she was making that yogurt… Damn, I’d be there every day.
I think Jeff called it nasty or something in Pink Slip. One of those episodes I’ll never watch again so I can’t be precise.
And I have no idea how seriously brain damaged Jeff is to be taken!
Dave’s right. It was Pink Slip. “Feral” Chuck asks about Jeff and Lester seeing Sarah. Jeff replies, “Just through the lens of a telescope, when she goes in and out of that nasty yogurt shop.” He could have meant the shop is nasty because she stopped wiping to counters, but he probably meant the guava-flavored yogurt.
How would he know if it’s nasty or not? His taste palate consists solely of beer.
Or perhaps it’s just nasty because she kicked Jeff out and wouldn’t serve him….
The guy ate a used urinal cake. If he thought it was nasty, it must be really nasty.
Maybe he just really hates guave?
Is it wrong of me to be so pleased that The Firm debuted in it’s new timeslot Thursday’s at 10 following NBC’s best night of lead ins with the exact same rating that Greenblatt was complaining about for Chuck on a friday at 8? Seriously they are not in any position to piss off any viewers. A 1.0 at 10pm on thursdays is much much worse than Chuck has been doing.
uplink that’s between you and a higher power. granted he was rude ignorant and everything else but the demise of actors/techs/screenwriters/makeup artists and the list goes on, not associated with him just doesn’t seem fair to me. those others didn’t say or do anything wrong, they just happen to work for an idiot. that’s just my opinion BTW.
Well that’s both funny and satisfying in a Schadenfreude sort way!
whats funny is i actually gave it a shot, lasted 10 minutes and scrapped it. i don’t think it’s gonna make it.
I saw it got some pretty terrible reviews too.
I did watch The Finder with 2 Chuck alums and it was ok. MCD was good and Mercedes will be good if she tones it down a bit but main character was unlikable at least at first. It will have Idol as a lead in next week which will help but its 1.7 wasn’t very good either.
Well, the people who work on The Firm are going to get fired before Greenblatt does and that’s never anything I cheer about. They aren’t responsible for what was said to anger you.
FWIW, I wasn’t bothered by what he said. It was honest. From what I heard about his presentation to the press, that was his persona. He didn’t try to BS them and some of journalists I follow liked that.
There’s a lot of ways to be honest without being rude. It’s not like politician or jerk are the only choices…
Let’s try that again for clarity; its not like total suck up or total jerk are the only choices…
I agree, I wasn’t at all bothered about his comments. Blunt? Yeah. Truthful? Yep. Was he right? Definitely. People will argue that he could’ve said it nicer, but it feels like a breath of fresh air to me.
No BS is good. Rudeness is not. Taking cheap shots at people who were not involved in asking the inappropriate question (i.e. “the masses” who are watching) is worse.
I’ve seen people without skin in the game consider rudeness and cheap shots entertaining. People with thick skin would not take Greenblatt’s comments personally. People with thin skin might. However none of that means he should act like a jerk at a PR event. It is possible to be polite and tell it “the way it is” at the same time.
In sports press conferences, journalists occasionally ask impertinent questions of coaches. I’ve seen several cases when the coach goes off on the asker or simply walks out. It always becomes a bigger deal than it should be. When it is analyzed later, a few people like it (usually because they think it is funny), but most criticize the coach for not being above it and acting like a professional. The coach then gets a bad reputation that follows them for years. The only upside I’ve ever seen is when it is converted into a funny Coors commercial. I assume they get royalties from that.
When a politician insults a portion of their constituency like that, they start losing support.
Well, the key thing is my comment about the people who make The Firm. It’s not cool to me to cheer them losing when they didn’t do anything.
If Greenblatt eventually loses his job and you still don’t like him, cheer away. But, I don’t understand wishing ill will on people who did nothing to you.
I agree about not cheering for people to get fired, even after the fact. I think the strongest statement like that I said in one of my previous posts was someone should keep him away from a microphone until he gets some training.
I don’t wish ill of anyone associated with The Firm, but that isn’t the point. The point is Greenblatt.
I think with the actors and crew of a TV show they go into it with hopes, but no illusions. They don’t get into the business looking for 30 years and a gold watch. Failed shows is a part of their business. And rooting against another ill-conceived cookie-cutter “blockbuster smash hit” from an industry so bereft of originality that their idea of a great new idea for a series is a remake of a movie based on a book is not necessarily rooting against the actors and crew hired to churn out the product. In fact I think you can make the case that in some instances it’s better for them to move on to better projects. Adam Baldwin had two single season series between Firefly and Chuck, and frankly I’m glad both failed. If Zac Levi was still churning out episodes of Almost Perfect, well he’d have a steady paycheck, but he’d have missed out on what he himself would tell you was one of the greatest experiences in his life. I hold no ill will for any of the people hired to make the stuff, they’re doing a job, but I’ll continue to hope that the vast majority of the crap that passes for entertainment in Hollywood continues to fail until they get a clue and figure out how to deliver quality shows to the consumer.
One last thought. If we’re supposed to be sensitive to the cast and crew of The Firm, what about Greenblatt? He gets a pass for essentially mocking his most loyal customers as insufficiently committed and mocking the cast and crew he basically just fired? As Jeff said above, there is a way to be frank without being a jerk.
New comment from Yvonne in CNN interview:
“There will be a couple of people who will come back. We sort of get back to the heart of Chuck, and that is the relationship between the characters. I can say that that will become the primary focus leading up to the end.”>
Interesting. So more folks coming back? Hmmmmmmm Mary for one certainly but does this mean Jill? Bryce?
That caught my attention, too. I wonder if someone showed up that they are keeping very secret.
It’s Shaw! *ducks* *crawls for behind furniture* *covers head as furniture is blown up* *waves white flag* I was just kidding!
Well, if the Weinerliscious is coming back, can Scooter be too far behind?
I could imagine Jill coming back. I hope Bryce doesn’t come back from the dead again. Cole, Carina, or Zondra would be fun, but I don’t think they’d need to keep those secret. Although maybe at this point they don’t care about ratings, they’d be more like Easter eggs.
Jill is in jail, and I don’t see any benefit of bringing her back. Bryce is dead, as is PapaB.
We know LH is coming back, so there’s one. Could the other be TD? Or maybe PapaB in flashback.
Jill’s on the run not in jail. And I think Sarah catching up with her unexpectedly could be a very interesting encounter.
Dave here’s a crazy one for ya. when jill and chuck were together they had sex, lol. she’s been on the run with chucks kid, thats the secret she comes back with. chew on that one for a while!
Oh right, Dave. Brain cramp. I still think she’s a character who’s relevance has come and gone, as far as the rest of the story. But you’re right an accidental run in with Sarah would be fun to watch.
Yeah army, I would not call that fun. Besides, any sex they had would have been in November of 2008, when last we saw her was April of 2009. She was not pregnant. Not that time lines ever bother the Chuck writers, but that really doesn’t work.
Well, according to Chuck, a flight from LAX to Moscow takes roughly 3 hours. I wouldn’t be surprised if they threw the whole “9 months for a pregnancy” out of the window as well. 3 months is more than enough for a Baby ‘Towski (Not counting the Woodcomb baby, but Clara was awesome enough to take the whole 9 months)
Dave they were also off on ellies baby. we still can’t figure out the time line on that one, or when she was with the CATS or went to LA or…these people have no concept of time, none. BTW it was mostly said in jest.
on a side note. on a spoiler site i visit rumor is volkoff is back for the last 2 eps. the person is looking for the interview where it was leaked. if he gives a link i’ll post it to comfirm.
In broadcast time, Ellie’s pregnancy was Sept 20->Jan 31. Chuck vs the Suitcase, broadcast on Sept 27, was week sometime after “week 12” and Ellie said she wasn’t due for “six months”. Clara was born 4 months later in broadcast time, so they only lost 2 months. If they didn’t get an extension, Push Mix could have easily been broadcast during the typical re-run/dead time in March.
All of this is reminding me of the “geometric pregnancy” in Farscape. For Sebaceans (advanced humans, some genetically engineered to be soldiers in space), after conception the fetus goes into stasis and can stay that way for years. When released, the entire pregnancy can take just a few days. It eliminates months of shows with a pregnant mother while making the “Who’s the daddy?” question really interesting.
Volkoff coming back could be fun. I’m not sure if I prefer him as Volkoff or Hartley though? I mean, Volkoff would clearly be more fun as a returning baddie (possibly with a grudge towards the Bartowskis for squandering his fortune!); but it raises all sorts of troubling aspects about an Intersect coming back. Maybe its not a biggie if the CIA conspiracy cabal decided to re-Intersect him.
But I really like the idea of Sarah having to get the Intersect (tonight maybe?), so maybe Hartley is tracked down to help in its removal.
And army I knew you were mostly kidding, but boy that one rubs me wrong!
Hartley as one of the unexpected sources of help, maybe?
Two things on this; first since the synopsis of the finale where it said help from unexpected sources I had figured that there would be suprising returns that were secret. Who they are is open to discussion, Cole? Bryce? Roan? Carina? Secondly is the possibility of one of the cast being Orion’s sleeper, in the original outline Awesome was to be a sleeper russian agent keeping eyes on Chuck, wouldn’t it make sense for another to be at the Buy More protecting him like Bryce did at Stanford. Possibilities Big Mike? Awesome? Fernando? Skip? Jeff?
I’d guess one of the unexpected sources is Chuck’s mom, who we haven’t seen this season.
I’m just worried we don’t get a Sarah-forgetting-her-memory thing. D:
Er.. wow. I worded that poorly. What I meant to say is..
“I’m just worried we’ll get a Sarah-forgetting-her-memory thing.”
Carry on!
I wouldn’t be surprised if that plays into it katsumaro, but I bet it won’t end on a down note at all. This is Chuck, it’s all about hopeful and uplifting!
ChuckGasmics’s Razorback seems to think that shippers will love the finale and I don’t doubt that the very end will be happy-ish, I’m just worried that the characters might get permanently maimed (physically or mentally) on the way there.
We’ll see.
I sort of wonder if the thing taken from them is the Intersect … again … and the process harms Sarah (memories and/or whatever). But I can’t figure out the secret part.
Encouraging words, Jam, and understandable worries. From all things said (love letter to fans, Chuck and Sarah get the biggest payoff, all about Chuck and Sarah love story, and now Razorback’s remark), I have to think that things will turn out well for Chuck and Sarah. But as Yvonne tells us, the road getting there will be edgy.
I still think the most likely secret is either something ugly she does on an a mission (as the Intersect) or something she learns about the origins of the Intersect program (like possibly her own intended role). One other possibility is that she’s pregnant, but in her Intersect fueled cockiness (hmmm, interesting adjective for a pregnant woman…) doesn’t want to be distracted or benched because of it. Actually that might make sense if the drama that goes nearly to the end is waiting to find out of Sarah harmed the unborn child while doing Intersecty things. Obviously the ending would only be “good” if the baby is fine!
But whatever is going on, I think in the end Sarah will get a total pass because the Intersect is screwing with her brain. It’s always good to hear more optimistic reports about the ending. I still expect some tense moments, possibly a really intense cliffie at the end of Bullet Train; but by the end of Goodbye we’ll all be happy with what we got. Yeah I’m an optimist…
Dave i’m not sold on her doing anything much as the intersect unless quinn can fix it. that would bring the whole why did he need it to a whole different level. as the promo’s show she crashes hard when she flashes, grabs her head, screams in pain and passes out. not good for an agent in the field. it’s basically making her useless. i am on board with her finding out information about the origin of it, although i thought they covered that pretty well in agent x.
opps quinn got in there by mistake. should be they fix it.
At this point we just don’t know how it will play. But perhaps the pain we saw is just part of the program re-writing her mind. Maybe after a few excruciating flashes they will hurt less as the Intersect takes over?
At any rate, I agree Sarah learning something she isn’t eager to share seems the most likely scenario. But there are multiple possibilities.
Thinkling – I was wondering about the secret too, so I went back to the synopsis for 5:12 – SARAH MUST KEEP A SECRET FROM CHUCK IN ORDER TO ACCOMPLISH A MISSION. After a harrowing mission, Sarah (Yvonne Strahovski) returns to Chuck (Zachary Levi) with a huge secret.
So here’s my take on it – I think the harrowing mission is 5:11 Bullet Train. We see in the promo the harsh effect the intersect has on Sarah & I’m wondering if, at that time, her memories are compromised and her allegiance shifts to Quinn, who sends her on her mission – to kill Chuck. Of course she is going to keep that from him if she is going to accomplish her mission.
Yeah, Peter, a Mr and Mrs Smith sort of plot. Eesh, I hope not, but Yvonne did say she was surprised they were willing to go there. So could be (biting nails).
I think that would be kind of cool. I mean the idea of Chuck actually physically fighting Sarah would be kind of epic – as you say a la Mr and Mrs Smith; while that’s happening the others are trying to find ways of helping Sarah snap out of it only for Chuck to do it anyway – just by being himself (It’s constantly hinted this season that as long as they have each other they’ll be fine – I reckon that’s the point) Her memory may not back fully, but enough for them to know they love each other.
I think Peter’s spec makes sense. There was that picture released on Twitter where Chuck had a big bruise on his cheek. Given they rarely have Chuck show any effects of his fights in the form of bruises or cuts (much less than Sarah or Casey), they must have a significant reason to have a big bruise this time.
…but I will add to the above that her mission could be broader than killing Chuck. If that was her only mission, she could accomplish that rather quickly. “Hello, Chuck.” {Bang}
“Goodbye, Chuck.”
Maybe the mission has something to do with infiltrating the CIA and stealing more Intersect tech.
Maybe he’ll want her to get the Orion computer for some reason – as far as we’re aware it’s still in Castle. At least I think it is???
Could one of the admins fix/delete my post just above this – a few unfortunate spelling errors.
dkd – I wish I had paid more attention to all those twitpics that came out – seems to be a wealth of info in them. Regarding broader mission, you are probably right. I am very curious how they are going to play this out and, for the first time, thankful they are playing the eps back to back. Based on what I suspect, don’t think I’d want to wait the week between 12 & 13.
Could they in fact tie the Shaw arc into this final arc. Shaw’s aim – apart from trying to destroy Sarah was to create the intersect 3.0. As we know Chuck reverse engineers the glasses so Shaw uploads the Omen virus, which means they must still have it. Perhaps Quinn wants Sarah to get intersect 3.0 for him.
Just to pour some more fuel on the fire, I found this.
http://www.tvrockstars.com/chuck-spoilers-sarah-must-keep-a-secret/
While it doesn’t give a lot away, it does reinforce earlier comments & spec.
Yeah it sounds like – Just as it happened with Morgan, Sarah’s mind becomes compromised and Quinn manipulates her into doing his bidding (perhaps as I say he either wants the Orion computer or the intersect 3.0 or something else entirely) – maybe we get to see a Charah fight scene, in which Chuck is desperate to try and make her see sense simply defends himself (almost reminds me of a scene in the fic Chuck vs Sarah,Sam and Lady Valkirie by Thereisanother – great fic btw, go read it if you haven’t. Anyway I’m referring to the scene where Sarah literally goes nuts and starts beating Chuck and all he does is defend himself and doesn’t fight back.) Might not go quite like that but I can see it being quite intense.
We’ve been guessing for a while that Sarah is corrupted by the Intersect enough that she’ll be doing Quinn’s bidding against Chuck. It wouldn’t surprise me if the final act of Quinn’s plan involves her killing Chuck. But of course, that will be Quinn’s undoing; because Chuck will find a way to defeat the program, possibly helped by Sarah fighting the Intersect herself.
That would mean we’d get another impassioned plea from Chuck, breaking through with his words (just like Three Words, Coup d’Etat, and Cliffhanger).
Chuck using his words is what he tends to be good at.
Jeff you forgot frosted tips!
Thanks, Army. I stopped thinking of good examples when I started remembering when Chuck’s speeches had failed (Gravitron, Nacho Sampler, Other Guy, Sandworm, etc.).
Jeff, your welcome. i remembered that one because i said it would happen when i outline the episode before it aired. if i remember correctly i got most of it right.
Chuck monologues more than the bad guys sometimes. He even tried in Bo, but Quinn cut him off for his own monologue.
“dkd – I wish I had paid more attention to all those twitpics that came out – seems to be a wealth of info in them.”
That’s why I saved them all. The other interesting thing about that picture and a few others from them filming that episode is the presence of Sarah Lancaster. We rarely see Ellie with them when they are in “mission mode”. So, she’s involved somehow in what goes down.
For your viewing pleasure I just added the promo for episode 5.11 – Chuck vs. The Bullet Train up top.
Thanks joe!
If I remember correctly, the last time Sarah said “Surprise” like that was when she was wearing wings. I think it’s safe to say Chuck liked that surprise better.
Okay, definitely not the place but I HAVE to let people know.
WATCH. SHERLOCK!
Series just aired its second season finale and I can without a SHADOW of a doubt say that it was the best episode of any tv show of this year. I tried to be critical of the episode, I truly was. But roughly 5 minutes, I said: “Screw it,” and just accepted it at face value. Amazing acting, amazing writing… just amazing.
If you get the chance, watch it! You will not regret it.
The Chuck vs Sarah plot thickens or gets more confusing. http://www.tvrockstars.com/chuck-spoilers-sarah-must-keep-a-secret/
Those tired of Chuck and Sarah keeping secrets from each other, raise their hands.
I would say that Yvonne S.’s comments on the episode are upbeat though. She calls it “brave” that the writers would craft an episode like this. Since she has read the script and completed the episode, acting wise; I would prefer to follow her judgement right now about it.
Also, sometimes playing it safe results in boring or medicore episodes where taking a risk results in exhilarating storytelling. Just my thoughts.
I take “brave” to indicate a pretty rough road ahead. I think I would have preferred more sweet and fun episodes to close the series out; but every one of their rough rides have panned out okay in the end so I’m not terribly worried about it. Everyone involved has described the end as “satisfying”, so I’m pretty confident we’ll all be happy with the outcome.
Fedak is so stubborn it’s comical. Can’t have a healthy marriage without lying and secrets.
throwing in my ideas here. some of these will anger some or may not. i am not putting a time line on these just saying i believe they will happen over the course of the next three episodes. i plan on keeping score, lol, to see how i did. if i repeated anything from anybody, it means i agree.
chuck will re-intersect
sarah will leave chuck (extended time not for a mission)
sarah will tell chuck she was sent by grahm and to control him by getting him to fall for her.
chuck and casey will chase sarah trying to get her back
sarah will lose her memory in an intersect/manchurian candidate way
sarah rejoins the CIA
chuck and sarah will have a physical combat encounter
sarah will injure/kill chuck or someone close to him (non buymore)
sarah will not get all her memories back but will agree to date chuck
chuck will end quinn
PANTS box comes back
they revisit the vandalized house and the etched sarah/chuck starts the memories coming back
Actually army none of that would “anger” me, but it does sound like a lot for only three episodes. Your overall outline may be pretty accurate, but I’m thinking you have too many details.
A lot of that would anger me, especially “sarah will tell chuck she was sent by grahm and to control him by getting him to fall for her” .. because that would certainly piss over continuity and make zero sense considering what we’ve actually seen on the show.
“sarah will not get all her memories back but will agree to date chuck” is also super lame imo, throwing 5 years of character growth in trash sounds like incredibly stupid idea to me.
Dave not really. c/s fight and hurts someone could be in the same scene. box/memories/date could be in the final scene at the house. join CIA/long separation, think gobbler opening scene where casey says shes been gone a month, one line explains the FF. i may have listed them separate, i never said they all occurred at different times.
Jam i thought of that one because of how they brought grahm back in the baby. there has to be a reason for it. i think they brought up in the past how female agents used their feminine wiles to get a mark to do what they want.
And of course telling Chuck something doesn’t make it true. That is, she could return with an Intersect/Quinn fueled agenda that results in her telling Chuck some hurtful lies.
In the end, I’m sure we will have no doubt Sarah has always loved Chuck and will continue to do so.
Dave very true, but it could be true just that she actually fell for chuck. her actually falling for chuck was never part of the plan when she got assigned to chuck. wasn’t that part of the whole wt/wt it’s complicated mess?
Except army if she was really ordered to “use her feminine wiles” on Chuck certain things would have been much different; like being physically intimate much earlier.
For Sarah to claim now that she was “ordered into a relationship” with Chuck would be misleading. Apparently she was only ordered to stay by him, with full discretion on how to accomplish that.
If that’s wrong, meaning if Graham actually had ordered her to seduce Chuck, then it actually makes Sarah look even better; because she did avoid leading him on any more than necessary and resisted a deeper relationship until they were completely free of asset/handler issues.
Chuck knows all of this perfectly well. He knows she was ordered to be his “cover” girlfriend. If Sarah says something to make the situation seem worse than it was, it is almost certainly a lie. She could conceivably counter with something about being good enough to know exactly how to manipulate Chuck. But as I said before, that is a clear lie told purely to be hurtful. And even though Chuck may initially be hurt by such a lie, I think he’ll actually see through it pretty quickly.
I agree, Dave. If Sarah says something like that, it would be a lie that Chuck would see through (after the initial shock), exactly like Frosted Morgan saying Chuck and he weren’t friends.
Dave, i just predicted they will happen not that there will be a good reason for it.
I tried this before Subway and Ring 2. The results were embarrassing. Good luck with your score. Here are my thoughts:
– chuck will re-intersect — I thought that before, but they need an Intersect. If they rejoin the CIA maybe.
– sarah will leave chuck (extended time not for a mission) — Mission time more likely, unless it is a kidnapping that leads to a brain washing.
– sarah will tell chuck she was sent by grahm and to control him by getting him to fall for her. — This is already covered in the show. The mission evolved over time. Sarah was sent Burbank and CHuck to find out what Bryce did with the Intersect, find out what he was up to, and possibly recover the Interset. After they figured out Chuck had the Intersect, she was supposed to manipulate him to cooperate (i.e. asking him on a date in Helicopter). After they figured out it couldn’t be removed (i.e. it’s a long term mission) she was supposed to control the asset but not get too close (as shown for two seasons).
– chuck and casey will chase sarah trying to get her back — maybe, especially with the kidnapping/brain washing idea
– sarah will lose her memory in an intersect/manchurian candidate way — I consider those two different possibilities, both possible
– sarah rejoins the CIA — possible, but I’d guess she only does if they both do.
– chuck and sarah will have a physical combat encounter — possible
– sarah will injure/kill chuck or someone close to him — Injure possible, but I seriously doubt kill. That would be too dark.
– sarah will not get all her memories back but will agree to date chuck — this idea made more sense when we thought Chuck might be the one getting the Intersect again and losing his memories. It makes less sense to me because it would eliminate Sarah’s growth over five seasons. I think Chuck’s growth is a lot easier to reproduce than Sarah’s. (Changing a loveable loser into a confident guy can be done with a good woman and her business plan, but changing a closed-off spy into a normal girl is a lot harder.)
– chuck will end quinn — as in kill? I doubt they would revisit that. HOWEVER, the loss of innocence would be a non-physical loss. So I wouldn’t be surprised.
– PANTS — nah
– revist house to restore memories — I like that idea
Jeff don’t they still have the intersect 3.0 or did they give that back to Beckman? – in which case they could ask to use it on Chuck. The fight thing could be possible and would be awesome imo and I think she will injure Chuck during it. I think she will remember enough to know she loved Chuck and takes out Quinn instead.
i’ll try to touch on my reasons for a few of these, lol.
chuck needing an intersect. didn’t shaw download/make the new one and chuck just corrupted it in santa suit? so he would have that one in CI.
casey/chuck chase sarah, based on the synopsis for 13. as he races to stop Nicholas. leads me to think he’s mostly on his own. since i said sarah will not be with him it fits.
not getting all her memories back. i’m thinking the intersect she got has similar to morgans. he has blank spots. like forgetting movies and such?
like i said to dave these are just things i predict will happen. they may or may not fit with canon, or even happen, lol. i just think they will happen.
ok heres one more. at the end of bullet train sarah will be with quinn.
The Intersect 3.0 was infected with a virus. It could remove an Intersect, not add one. We don’t know if it was given to Beckman. She was around, and knowing the government, she would have wanted it for analysis. Carmichael Industries needed money, so I’m sure they would sell it to them.
The government might have the Orion laptop from S4. It would have been reclaimed when they cleaned out Castle. The Morgansect and Sarahsect glasses were produced somewhere (probably stolen from the government). I just was pointing out Carmichael Industries doesn’t have an Intersect sitting around. Chuck might need to get it from the CIA, which might require re-enlisting.
Jeff didn’t chuck infect the new intersect? i seem to remember him doing that. then giving the device to shaw.
I thought Chuck just replaced the intersect 3.0 with the Omen virus but if he did simply infect it then that idea is out I guess.
I think Chuck infected the Macau device, which then infected or corrupted the Intersect 3.0, leaving it unusable. However my DVR did not get that episode, so I only saw it live when I was out of town.
Jeff forgot one. the intersect/manchurian candidate. this was hard one to separate. the intersect effectively changes sarahs memories and creates the new ones. the intersect actually brainwashes sarah. clear as mud huh?
I think we have to be a little careful here. We can’t know yet if Sarah was Intersected with the 3.0 or the 3.0 infected version. It could be something from the CIA lab (prior to Shaw’s messing with it, adding the Omen virus) or it could be something “fixed” by them. Call it the 3.2 (that’s an MS call-back, btw 😉 ).
That would be shades of Hartley/Volkoff – decent continuity at least (Morgan having the same issue)
Joe, my guess all along was she got the one morgan had. remember he hid the glasses before the 3.0 ever came about. we are trying to figure out if CI has the new intersect that shaw was making.
jeff i thought the purpose of the cold CI was to keep the computers from over heating while gathering the information shaw needed to put into the device. shaw was saving data in the CI computers. that’s why i say they have it. he would download the data to the computers in CI then put it into the device then use the glasses to upload it into himself. if that the case they still have the data and can unbug the device and use it for chuck.
Army, didn’t Ellie say that the glasses Morgan got were a “one-shot deal?” I’ve been assuming that they simply couldn’t be the same glasses or even the same Intersect version (but I guess that’s possible).
Joe yes she did, however i’m not saying the same pair of glasses morgan used, just the same program from in the ones morgan used. i’m not even gonna question where he got the intersect glasses loaded with the intersect to hide in the first place. i was just saying that he hid the glasses before the new intersect was made, so…it would be a version that already existed.
The only multi-use glasses we’ve seen were Manoosh’s, and those were temporary.
* chuck will re-intersect
*for mission 1/2* sarah will leave chuck (extended time not for a mission)
* sarah will tell chuck she was sent by grahm and to control him by getting him to fall for her.
chuck and casey will chase sarah trying to get her back
* sarah will lose her memory in an intersect/manchurian candidate way
sarah rejoins the CIA
* chuck and sarah will have a physical combat encounter
sarah will injure/kill chuck or someone close to him (non buymore)
* sarah will not get all her memories back but will agree to date chuck
chuck will end quinn
PANTS box comes back
*they revisit the vandalized house and the etched sarah/chuck
6 1/2 out of 12 is actually very impressive for 11 days ago. Well done.
don’t i get the point for the injuries sustained in the fight? she hit him with a gun and busted him up pretty good? i get half a point for the CIA one. she did think she was working for them, right?
Damn buttons…Thanks i did pretty good!
She thought she was still working for then (REjoins). That looses a 1/2. The fact she never really was looses the other 1/2.
The fight injuries the kind that magically heal in 12 hours on TV shows. It’s the real-world equivalent of a paper cut. But I’ll give you another 1/4.
New total: 6 3/4.
But feel free to use your own scoring system of weighting some as 2 stars and others as 3.
Nah jeff i’m good. it was just for fun anyway. some i actually wished i got wrong but ehh
http://t.co/PF2OJxc2
intresting, square one stuff and relationships going full circle? strange.
“All homegey”?? I’m loving it already. Especially with all the pilot references – I guess this is where the Weinerlicious comes into it. Man I’m super hyped.
I think we may really see Sarah memories wiped back to before Chuck initially. If they make it a “falling in love all over” it could be a beautiful thing. Memory loss is one of the few ways that story theme can ever really work.
But of course, we have to end with the hope of those memories coming back (or even better, see everything come back over the course of the episode). Everything just lost seems way too dark. The good news on all of this might be a real focus on Chuck and Sarah for a big part of the episode (which IS what Yvonne was saying last week).
i find the difference between zl an ys interesting. he says fans will get a kick out of it, while she says a tragedy happens and satisfying.
I think Yvonne more often speaks to the mood and feeling of things while Zach is more likely to look at the adventure of it.
Very stereotypical male/female difference! Sad thing is I’ve come to see things like the woman…
I think Yvonne is more in touch with fans than Zach, particularly in the relationship aspects.
You know I agree 100% on that Thinkling!
I am inclined to suspect that the intersect is a corruptive force for Sarah that turns her against Chuck. The Mr/Mrs Smith scenario is really interesting as Chuck fights for his life against the love of his life.
I also think the ending will be the beach…this time it’s Chuck walking out to meet Sarah…a “hopeful” sign but one we as viewers–and shippers—will have to fill in the blanks on how it all works out for our couple.
As an aside, I have never, ever been right in any spec 🙂
I wouldn’t mind a beach scene – with Chuck being the one to ask Sarah to trust him. Though I really hope it doesn’t end there. I’d at least hope we get Sarah realising she loves him. Because if we end on a beach scene, talk about buzz kill (5 years of character growth down the crapper.)
Yeah I agree entirely lappers. Although the beach scene might be a wonderful homage, it can’t end there, we need to actually SEE things getting better than that.
Maybe it could extend to her saying “let’s go home” or something. Obviously after they both confess their love for each other.
If Sarah indeed will lose her memories, I think nothing but a 100% restoration of them before the finale is over will satisfy me.
Anything else would be awful, ruin 5 years of character growth and pretty much ruin the finale and the whole show for me.
Still hoping it’s something else.
I agree, total buzz kill. But apparently over the years YS has been a huge shipper and I wouldn’t take her words “slightly tragic” lightly. That’s why I think they will be together but b/c of intersect and memory loss will have to re-invent their relationship.
Jam (and RAC), I think most could live with a very “Chuck” like “There’s a few foggy areas in there…”
And speaking for myself, I wouldn’t mind a bit if she never remembered a “couples massage” and a trip to Tiffany’s.
I don’t want to say that they’ve been predicable (’cause really, I haven’t been able to predict them with any accuracy). But the Chuck MO has been to get us to imagine the worst, then delivering on darn near the best.
I venture that they’re doin’ it again!
If Sarah’s memories are wiped for good then Fedak is dead to me. Sarah has had a terrible life and for her to lose all the memories of the only bright spot in her life is truly sadistic. Fedak better crawl in a whole after that.
Sarah’s memories won’t be wiped for good rac; WAY too dark an ending for this show. The only question to me is how far we get to see her come back in the end. I’m hoping all the way, but I have a feeling as 5.13 runs out I’ll be nervously watching the time the whole way!
I doubt it will be too bad – It might be bad for a while – especially with the inclusion of the Weinerlicious (perhaps her mind is temporarily wiped back to 2007) but by the end it will probably be no worse than Morgan’s situation (just forgetting some pop culture stuff).
Yeah lappers that’s sort of what I expect too.
Having said that how much pop culture what she forget anyway, and would it really bother her that much – she did claim it was gibberish. LOL.
HOLY CRAP!!! I still can’t believe there’s only two weeks of Chuck left. Man, I’m getting properly hyped.
Exactly lappers. If all she loses is pop culture stuff, that will be minimal (like almost 0) loss.
I don’t think Chuck would mind having to start her pop culture education all over.
Agreed 100%
If Sarah forgets Chuck they pretty much wipe out the reason I loved the show. I will peobably never watch it or talk about it again. Fedak writes some crazy love letters.
If that did happen Chris Fedak would never work again.
Just quit worrying about it man, it’s NOT going to happen.
OK – I am going to surprise myself here, if Sarah loses her memory, and a good portion (say 3 scenes worth) of the last episode is Chuck reconnecting with her while they take down the bad guy, that might make for a pretty good last episode, assuming it all works out ok in the end.
Spock lost everything in a Star Trek movie, what the heck, Sarah Walker probably kicks his butt in a fight, right!
What I really don’t want to see is much interaction between the fat 50 something brought on as this year’s big bad and Sarah, if they waste their last two episodes ever on 4 or 5 or more scenes between the two of them, then TPTB blew it, but if this whole stupid memory loss foreshadowed by Morgansect leads to more rather than less Chuck and Sarah chemistry time, what the heck, that is NEVER a bad thing, ever.
Maybe they even can make passionate love at the conclusion of the scene where Sarah tries to kill Chuck?
Anyhow, carry on with the debate and fight the good fight, in less than ten days something else will have to be the brunt of one’s passion and / or ire …. unless of course Ernie tries to convince everyone season 3 contains the lost Dead Sea Scrolls, with the cypher key impeded in ‘my desert is contained within yours’ ….
I think I get on board with the speccing (sp.?) going on above.
My biggest issue is that it certainly looks like they waited too long before telling such a story and will have to “magically” resolve it (who are we kidding, of course that will happen) to give us a happy ending. That would suck.
Angus Macfadyen is 48, a year and a half younger than Adam Baldwin. Volkoff got better in each scene. I’m still playing a wait-and-see with Quinn.
Look at the bright side. If she gets amnesia at least she will never have to remember she slept with a log. 🙂
That would be a plus.:)
If only they could offer such selective amnesia to the fans…
We all assume Sarah slept with the log, but that is actually a plot hole assumption. But in the spirit of the plot hole/retcon arguments… We only know they kissed. Sarah was very good at conning and manipulating people. She could have easily gotten a spa package and some diamond earrings out of an idiot like Shaw without sleeping with him. We also know she liked the twilight tranqs.
We only know Chuck slept with Jill and Hannah (although I really liked ninjaVanish’s version of Chuck/Hannah). The show writers protected Sarah’s “honor” by not revealing if anything happened with Shaw or with Bryce after she met Chuck.
Now accuse me while I go back to humming really loudly.
Yup Jeff you’re right about every bit of that. I’ve long said the one throw-away line I’d love to hear is “well, Shaw sure was trying hard to get into my pants but he never did…”
Of course if that’s ever said half the fans on the Internet will scream retcon. Even though strictly speaking it would not be; we have drawn a reasonable and unpleasant conclusion from what we’ve seen and been told. But that conclusion has neither been confirmed or denied. I’d love to see it denied. But I’m pretty sure TPTB mean to leave it alone.
I did love Ninjavanish‘s take on the Chuck/Hannah non-relationship. Probably the best version of that in the entire fandom.
Yeah, you’re forgetting that Sarah and Shaw actually went off-grid so they could spend a whole day in his penthouse doing God knows what. Tthough the not so subtle mentioning of the Kama Sutra later on in the episode makes it pretty clear what the implication was that they were up to.
MXPW come on now, we know they are still virgins! we never saw either them have sex, just wake up in the same bed and wearing skimpy clothes. of course if one of them admitted they had sex with someone in an episode i missed it would only apply to the one i missed, lol.
Which confirms exactly what Jeff and I were saying…
People will draw conclusions.
I think it’s pretty clear that Chuck and Sarah have had sex a few times (Coup detat and of course the false pregnancy in Kept Man.) And besides how could Sarah have sex with the 2×4 anyway – the guys made of wood for heavens sake. >_>
I hadn’t forgotten. It’s just a book. It suggests something, but is not confirmation and still leaves a (small) plot hole. Here’s another hum-really-loudly theory that fits the facts in the show:
Shaw wanted to try out his new 4-in-1 grill. While waiting for her grilled cheese to finish, Sarah saw his bookshelf included a book from someone clearly overcompensating for some kind of shortcoming. She (rightly) concluded there were better things she could be doing that afternoon. As a diversion, she suggested making a soufflé, which Shaw was actually interested in trying. She messed up the first two because Shaw kept kissing her neck at critical moments. (Did the guy have any sense of appropriate timing? First missions, then soufflés.) She finished the third around dinnertime. Deciding they needed some more substantial food, she ordered Bamboo Dragon on her cell. That reminded her of Chuck, which ruined the mood Shaw was trying to set with the three dozen candles he lit. Shaw understood, because he was using her to forget is wife like he figured she was using him to forget Chuck. They called it an early evening, and she went home to her empty hotel room, leaving him with an overcooked dessert. He spent the rest of the evening in a smokey room looking for his dessert contained in that one.
Well and Lappers we’ve been told several times since Honeymooners that Chuck and Sarah are intimate. That’s not my point.
It is very reasonable to conclude Sarah was also intimate with Shaw. And I believe the writers meant for us to draw that conclusion and consider it a fact. But as Jeff described above there absolutely is a narrow window of doubt. Now admittedly, this is “clutching at straws”, the reasonable conclusion remains that Sarah and Shaw were together. But if it were ever denied, it is NOT a retcon, it is filling a (very small) plot hole.
My theories are slightly tongue-in-cheek. Actually, because what Shaw said at the dinner that Awesome interrupted and because Sarah’s statements about all work in the DC trip, I assumed they were not really together. Casey’s interrogation about bills changed that. It wasn’t a retcon. It was a change of what I had incorrectly assumed. However it still did not definitively answer the question the other way either. I am still assuming.
Army you might be on to something…
– In Other Guy, Chuck was wearing his Chucks. Nothing happened.
– In Honeymooners that the only reason they were sweaty was they were doing push-ups.
– In Role Models, Morgan said they were having lots of sex, but that was his assumption. Chuck just said they were really happy.
– Chuck has implied they do something in the Castle’s storage closet, but it’s probably just making out.
– At the end of A-Team, Chuck asked if Sarah meant they would be having sex on the plane. We didn’t hear her answer, so they probably didn’t.
However, the pregnancy test in Kept Man is a good clue. I can’t figure out a way around that one. If they were using artificial insemination, Chuck wouldn’t have been surprised, and they wouldn’t be using a home pregnancy test. Even if they had an “open” marriage, the test implies Sarah is not a virgin and Hannah said Chuck had sex with her. So neither is a virgin. Sorry. Is this part of the score you are keeping? 😉
Jeff, nope that part was said in jest. in s3 didn’t chuck brag about having sex with hannah? i’m in the camp that they both enjoyed casual sex in their lives and with the people they dated.
You know, it just dawned on me that the idea of Sarah and Shaw having “relations” (ahem) is actually a bit of a retcon itself.
It’s not at all in keeping with *his* character. He’s supposed to be madly and literally insanely in love with his wife. Going after another woman, except as a complete act of revenge, is OOC.
Of course, we can believe that he is that vengeful (and that insane). But it’s not what you can call “having a relationship”, regardless of what Sarah felt.
Now it’s my turn to go humming along…
Joe, he’s a guy she’s hot, do i need to say more?
“The show writers protected Sarah’s “honor” by not revealing if anything happened with Shaw…”
Not so much, really. If you present enough circumstantial evidence, often enough and over a long enough period of time, you can convince people that something happened without ever offering definitive proof. Trial lawyers do it with juries all the time.
That is exactly what the showrunners did, rubbing it in episode after episode. They couldn’t seem to leave the issue of Sarah and Shaw alone, driving it home with the creepy interrogation scene and the Kama Sutra manual in 3.17 and topping it off with the insane “Oh my god…Daniel!” quote in 3.18. Just before Daniel Shaw murders Stephen Bartowski in cold blood in front of his children. There is something wrong there.
If I remember right, Schwartz and Fedak gave an interview to Sippenwall around the start of S4, where Schwartz said that the issue of Sarah and Shaw being lovers was always meant to be ambiguous.
It makes me wonder if he ever watched his own show.
Much as I hate to jump in to a season 3 Shaw conversation, I just have to ask, was I the only one who saw the Morgan/Alex as TPTB closing that door? Alex was hurt with a thoughtless breakup and acted out physically, Morgan, flush with his newfound power and prowess also managed to score, and then both Chuck and Sarah advise Morgan that it’s best to leave these things alone. Knowing the intimate and dirty details isn’t going to make anyone feel any better, and since they were broken up, no apologies are needed or expected. They’re even. I think it takes very little imagination to conclude Chuck and Sarah are speaking from experience, and TPTB are letting the fans know that it’s their affair, not ours. 😉
Agree with everythink Ernie. You said everything I feel about that storyline and the use of it last week.
Ernie, No your not the only one. I threw it out here: https://chuckthisblog.wordpress.com/2012/01/13/510-chuck-vs-bo-first-reactions/#comment-61065
But no one bit.
Agreed, Ernie, I definitely saw the parallels. Not only is it Chuck and Sarah’s business, but I’d say (as I’ve always assumed) that they have dealt with it.
Ernie I’m quite certain that was exactly the intent. Although to me it mostly just highlights how creepy the whole sotuation is. But I do agree if we won’t like the answer it’s best to leave it alone. Which is exactly what I believe they will do to the end.
Glad to see others have taken it up, sorry I’m a bit behind on the comments.
Ernie and Jeff have it; Alex, Morgan, goofy guy and Bo was the analogy of the love trapazoid and it is all the explanation that we are going to get, they are over it so we should be too
Heh, if the showrunners are trying to tell people that what goes on in the lives of Chuck and Sarah are none of the viewer’s business, they’re being a bit rediculous. That has been a big part of the entire show, right on back to the first scene with Chuck having a heart-felt conversation with his best friend in his bedroom.
As to the relationship between Alex and Dale mirroring what happened between Sarah and Shaw, um, not really. I haven’t seen any of this season’s episodes except for 5.1, but unless somewhere along the line Alex’s other guy gunned down Morgan’s father in the Buymore parking lot and Grimes Sr. died in his son’s arms on Morgan’s lunch break, there isn’t much similiarity at all.
Daniel Shaw murdered Stephen Bartowski in cold blood in front of his children.
Like it or not, that was a milestone in this series, and as a dramatic high point, it should have dramatic consequences. I realize that some people just want me to shut up about this, but I’m afraid I just have to play Beggar at the Dance where this is concerned. (I’m sure some of you can think of other analogies that you consider more accurate)
To paraphrase another poster at this site (I can’t remember who), if the showrunners are just going to hand-wave away the consequences of dramatic events, they shouldn’t have gone there in the first place.
VV well i didn’t use those words but i agree. it will happen again with this last arc. of course they really do much else can they?
VV its not that we shouldn’t care; but I think the not too subtle point was that the characters have gone past it, we should too. Telling Morgan he should leave it alone could be seen as telling us to leave it alone. I’m sure the writers had that double meaning in mind when they constructed the scene.
As it stands now, there does remain a small opening for deniability. Most viewers won’t buy it, but a few of us want to very much. So there it stands. And I don’t believe the writers will touch it again.
Dave,
“Some of us want to very much”.
That’s the interesting part of this debate for me – and I ask this as a genuine question rather than an attempt to stir things up. Why is it so important to believe that Sarah didn’t sleep with Shaw? I disliked the Shaw arc as much as anyone, but that’s because it was a cliched story – not because I need to believe that Sarah would never sleep with anyone else in the event that her and Chuck broke up.
The Tiffany scene annoyed me because keeping earrings from someone who has tried to kill you and your boyfriend is the sign of someone who needs professional help, and trashing Sarah’s character like that made no sense – but I take it as a given that Sarah slept with Shaw, and in character terms (as opposed to story terms), that never bothered me at all.
But some seem to need to believe something else, and I’m curious as to why?
I’m also curious as to why people are so ‘up in arms’ about Sarah with Shaw. Sure it’s icky as heck to think about.. (Which is why I try not to), but it’s not such a big deal. Chuck did have Jill and Hannah after all. D:
But.. they’re married now, they’re madly in love with one another and we’re coming down the stretch, so why think about it? 😀
@BigKev
I think its more about the character than the actual act.for some people. If Shaw’s character had been like Bryce or Cole it wouldn’t have ruffled feathers as much, But since he was the complete opposite it made Sarah look bad, That she’ll sleep with anyone that’s her partner regardless of their personality. Of course the writers never intended any of that but even in Baby they were still trying to push the notion that Shaw was a good guy.
Kev, i’m with JC on this one. there is a group of fans that put sarah in another world as a character. her sleeping with shaw tarnishes that idea. some fans go as far as saying that she never slept with bryce even though she said she was his girlfriend.
I assume Sarah slept with Shaw, but I don’t know that for a fact. The reason I laid out the ideas about how that might not have happened was to illustrate plot holes and assumptions. I probably shouldn’t get into this, but…
Even if Sarah slept with Shaw, it was a rebound from seeing Chuck with Hannah. I think she comes out looking better than Chuck does. That has always seemed like a minority opinion, compared to Sarah/Shaw deniers and people who hate either Sarah or TPTB for Sarah sleeping with Shaw, while giving Chuck a pass. After two years, I’ve accepted that. I’m not trying to convince or be convinced. I’m just sharing why I think this way…
Until Shaw saw the red test video, I saw his character as interchangeable with Bryce. They both were cocky and arrogant, had poor tactical judgement and devised poor plans, thought it was a good idea to hit on Sarah trying to distract her during missions, tried to manipulate Sarah’s feelings outside of missions, did reckless things that might break Chuck’s and/or their own cover, and in general were bad spies. On the surface, though, they both projected the good spy/American hero persona, which Sarah and the higher-ups in the government bought hook, line, and sinker. The only differences were Bryce had a tiny bit of loyalty to Chuck and Orion (while still treating Chuck like crap), and Shaw ended up evil.
In my book, there’s no difference between Sarah sleeping with Shaw or Bryce. I think viewers had more problems with Shaw because of the timing of the relationship against where they thought Chuck and Sarah’s relationship would be at the start of S3. Also in my book, Chuck sleeping with Jill when he did was less fair to Sarah. Hannah told Chuck exactly how badly he treated her.
The earrings were stupid, but no surprising for an ex-conwoman. The earrings were just a prize bought with money. The bracelet is a family heirloom. It is real. Sarah knows the difference.
@BigKev: I can’t speak for all fans (in fact, I’m sure I don’t) about the Shaw arc and wishing Sarah didn’t sleep with Shaw. My objections are objective and completely even-handed, being motivated by personal standards that most would deride as “old fashioned.”
That being the case, I haven’t liked any of the casual sex on the show. It bothered me that Chuck wanted to sleep with Lou less than a week after he met her. He didn’t, but only because the CIA intruded on his plans. I didn’t like that he slept with Jill so quickly. Even though they had been involved before, he no longer knew her. And Hannah, I hated that he slept with her, too.
Putting aside, for a moment, my personal moral code, it always struck me as a bit out of character for Chuck — a man who claims to respect women, one who would hardly hold Sarah’s hand, because he knew their relationship couldn’t go anywhere — to want to bed a woman he barely knew and, therefore, couldn’t possibly know if the relationship would ever go anywhere. It really tarnished Chuck’s character, by his own standards, not mine. Same thing with Hannah, especially so soon after he declares his love to Sarah and the desire to work things out … plus he’s still in love with Sarah, so it seems all wrong for him to jump Hannah.
But there are more reasons to object to the S3 geometry. And this is my perception, of course, but I see the geometry as a device to prolong wt/wt. I think prolonging wt/wt until the last episode drove the story and determined its various elements. Some of those elements (cough) didn’t serve the main story (IMO). Plus having the two leads break up with the subsequent requirement that they must each sleep with someone else is just offensive tripe. Could they be any more clichéd if they tried?
Within the show’s framework Sarah sleeping with Shaw does not bother me any more than Chuck sleeping with Hannah. In fact, it may even bother me less. I’ve said many times on the blog that I consider Sarah the more faithful of the two. She remained faithful to the cover relationship (which involved her very real feelings) even though she thought nothing would come of it. She was under the same constraints as Chuck (including personal feelings), but she rejected Bryce (her “Jill”) three times, and she rejected Cole (her “Lou”). By the time she went with Shaw, Chuck had dumped her twice and rubbed his exploits with Hannah in her face. So, she was free to date someone else.
The fact that the Shaw character was unlikable and didn’t really work chemistry wise (with anybody) is a separate issue. At that point, he was assumed to be a good agent and a good man (nobody knew about his vendetta). Any other why’s and wherefore’s I don’t want to get into. Like many others it made me sick to watch, but no sicker than Chuck with Hannah.
I agree with everyone that the earring thing was awful. What were they thinking!?
Sounds like our ideas are pretty close to the same, Thinkling.
About the earrings, while it makes little sense (except maybe the conwoman angle), it is a little funny. Funny as in the ‘inappropriate joke that you don’t want to laugh at but can’t help yourself’ way. Hannah is the OLI that bothered me the most, but the Ellie/Hannah scene is one of the funniest of S3.0. In both cases, they went too far for the laugh.
Yeah, Jeff, I agree that those scenes were funny, and that the laugh didn’t end up being worth it.
I also couldn’t help feeling that TPTB were rubbing Sham in our faces a little. It has sometimes felt like they reject the fans rejection of their choice of geometry and continue to try to justify it or convince us otherwise. Worse (meaning worse on me for thinking this way), I confess that it sometimes feels like they are thumbing their noses at fans who were hurt by S3 directions and just want to move on.
Not to shock anyone, but I completely agree with Thinkling on this. I was pretty irate and outspoken about it when Chuck slept with Hannah too. The only difference being we actually know that happened so there’s no wishing or hoping about it; Chuck behaved like a slime ball. By my archaic standards Sarah generally behaved better, or at least they left more room for thinking so, right up until Shaw. Sham did more to ruin Sarah in my eyes than any other event in the entire show, so naturally I’d love to hear it wasn’t as bad as I’d assumed.
Now for all that, I’m perfectly pleased to have a character learn from their mistakes and move on. I don’t hold a lot of mistakes against characters (or real people for that matter) as long as they admit their mistakes and try to do better. Sexual morality is often a tougher issue with me and main stream entertainment as my standards are clearly different from 90+% of society. I often try to let it go, at least to say I don’t expect those who don’t share my core beliefs to share my behavior. But I still like to see when people or characters behave in ways I can respect or relate to. Chuck has generally been a good and moral character; except his behavior with women does not get a pass, with Lou, Jill, and Hannah he was kind of a slime. Again, Sarah was generally better except for Shaw; at least she was discrete enough that some question remains….
And the ear rings/interrogation scene was actually the worst of it. It made plausible deniability very difficult, in addition to making Sarah look pretty dense.
I don’t think they were rubbing our faces in it. They write and film so far in advance (especially with S3 which started in January), that they don’t always know what the fan reaction will be.
We know Jeff was hidden in Shaw’s bathroom during the Sam name reveal. They probably thought that scene was funny. Blooper reels are canon, right?
Yeah Jeff, blooper reels must be canon; otherwise no one would ever fart on TV…
ha ha ha.
It would explain Jeff’s stalking dialogue in American Hero and his source of information for the 3×5 cards. He learned about the CIA from Shaw. He just didn’t recall it until he got away from the van’s CO emissions.
Interesting discussion and you guys should know me well enough to know I can’t stay out of a Shaw discussion. For me at least the issue of did she or did she not sleep with Shaw was answered by Stephen Bartowski. He called Shaw Sarah’s lover. That ends the discussion for me. Then couple that with the fact that they “stayed the entire day in his penthouse” after Chuck left for DC and that confirms when it happened.
Though I wish she didn’t sleep with him the clues are there and you can’t ignore them. Stupid? Yes but a betrayal? certainly not. Sarah deserves no crap for it except for it was a dumb choice but based on what she knew at the time it was a forgone conclusion. What bothers me most about it is people giving her crap about it but giving Chuck a pass. His douchebag wham bam thank you ma’am with Hannah is far worse IMO. But the show won’t let you crap on Chuck. But Sarah bashing seemed ok. The old unwritten Sarah Walker rule and all.
As far as the earring scene goes, that was absolutely disgusting and offensive to me the viewer, to women in general and to Sarah specifically. What made it worse was that it was played for laughs. Trying to show that an intelligent woman would wear earrings given to her by someone who tried to murder her and wear them in front the man she rejected for the murderer and now was in a relationship with was disgusting. And then they made it a hundred times worse by playing it for laughs. It may be second only to the name reveal the most offensive moment ever on the show. Completely inexcusable and a complete betrayal of the Sarah Walker character,
Can’t believe I missed that. Chuck vs Sarah is a LeJudkins episode, I’m even more excited for that one now. (what an honor it must be to write the penultimate ever episode of a TV show.)
I think that does make the likelihood of a satisfying story pretty high!
I think we are forgetting Sarah was going to live with the Guy in DC. Just thinking of that makes me shudder.
They were taking jobs in Washington after the Burbank operation was shut down. She never admitted to plans to move in with Shaw.
Look rac, we were clearly meant to think Sarah and Shaw were in an intimate relationship. But they really did leave just enough wiggle room that it could conceivably be denied. As I said elsewhere, I don’t expect that to ever happen. But it is not completely unreasonable or any kind of retcon if they do.
Fun discussion going on today. Throwing my two cents in, I think these next three episodes are about the culmination of Chuck’s journey since S1. Remember, the information released is that Chuck has to fight for everything that he has gained. This is not Carmichael Industries, it is Sarah and the confidence that she helped Chuck to gain that motivated him to where he his now. He not only has to save her, he has to save their relationship and the life that they are building.
Remember where Chuck was when the show began, he was truly a broken person whose life seemed destined for mediocrity and wasted potential. Then, an e-mail and the arrival of a blonde stranger began him on a path to greatness. This then is the culmination of his journey, and in the end that is who the show is about. Even with the great ensemble that has been assembled over the last five years, the show is called “Chuck” and everything is ultimately about his character and his journey.
Its kind of fun to still be carrying on right up to the end. I think next week may get REALLY nuts around here.
Agreed next week might be just “wee bit” crazy especially after “Bullet Train”. It is fantastic to see this passion from the blog this late in the game.
i’m waiting till after the last episode. if it doesn’t turn out like people want, who boy look out!
I’m thinking two weeks from now though things will start winding down pretty quickly. THAT will be depressing!
Well…we are back in angst-land 🙂
@andyt Everything you say might be true but to have this happen on the next to last episode seems unnecessary and will be rushed. I personally think that if you were going to go this route it should have happened in the middle of the season. Than maybe end up with a variation of the baby episode in 5.12, and a whole episode of Chuck and Sarah reconnecting and becoming one again. Fedak’s timing has always sucked.
BTW the Living Dead episode convinced me she had jumped the Shaw shark. Even evil Shaw referred to himself as an old boyfriend. The fact that she was still wearing his earrings was in really poor taste IMO. Fedak really damaged the Sarah character in season 3. I am hoping he does not go all out and have Sarah become Quinn’s girlfriend. He set that stage up with Morgan last week. I really do not want to think about it but that bothered me quite a bit.
Episode 5.12 might be a real tough one to handle. Having Sarah beat the crap out of Chuck will not be something I want to see. I have a strong suspicion that is exactly what is going to happen.
The thing to take from all this is that 5×12 is a LeJudkins episodes and if history proves anything they’ve done a damn good job in the episodes they’ve done so I for one am not too worried – we’ll get enough tension but I really don’t think it’ll be a case of Sarah becoming Quinns girlfriend – mayeb more of an underling or right hand to him while her mind is compromised by the intersect. As I’ve said before I think a fight scene between Chuck and Sarah is done right would be epic. But that’s just my opinion.
Ok that reply was riddled with spelling errors, but I think you get my point.
LeJudkins: Tic Tac, Honeymooners, Living Dead, Suitcase, First Fight, Push Mix, Masquerade, Wedding Planner, Bearded Bandit, and Baby. If they’re going to do an episode like this (what it sounds like 5.12 will be), then they are our best shot at liking it.
Yeah I agree lappers, spelling errors and all! I don’t think they’ll go there, Sarah will simply be Quinn’s weapon for a short period of time.
And even that (that she’ll be Quinn’s weapon for a time) isn’t a certainty, Dave. Of course, it’s an intriguing possibility (not where I would have gone, but …)
wow guess i’m in trouble 6 of those i didn’t like.
Isn’t that a good percentage for you, Army? 🙂
They also wrote Aisle of Terror (for me, possibly the worst of the list), and they have story editor credits on a few more. The optimist in me is looking at it this way: Since they joined the writing staff with Tic Tac, they wrote four of my top six episodes. Even when I didn’t like the episode as much (e.g. Living Dead) the episode did not fall completely flat because it had a lot of little moments I liked (e.g. Sarah interrogating Morgan, Sarah throwing the axe).
For all of you hanging your hopes on this one being a LeJudkins episode I can only say that Ali Adler wrote Fake Name, make of that what you will. Personally I think that Sarah will lose her personality like Morgan did at the beginning of the season and will become an unpleasant version of herself. Much the same as he did with Morgan and the story of the ham and mustach sandwich, Chuck will find a way to bring Sarah back to herself.
I can see her repudiating Chuck much like Morgan did “we’re not friends” but I don’t think that they would go so far as to have her start a romantic or physical relationship with Robert the Bruce. I also think this will be a midling part of what are likely to be many developments and a lot of big story moving very fast.
Jeff TBH i just know which ones i liked and which ones i didn’t. i don’t worry about who wrote them. i just happens they wrote ones i didn’t. if ya put a list out of another writer i may have liked them all, ya never know.
herder, that is a good reminder about Fake Name. AA wrote: Wookie, Truth, Cougars, Best Friend, Broken Heart, Ring, Three Words, Fake Name, the story for Honeymooners, the teleplay for Subway. Everyone thinks of AA’s Charah moments in shows like Wookie, Cougars and Best Friend, but Truth, Wookie, Broken Heart, and Three Words all had a lot of angst.
The trick is to ignore the story arc and look at the execution. The likely scenario is story arc and mythology was led my Fedak with input from the entire writers’ room. Someone had to write Fake Name. It wasn’t entirely her idea. The question is how was the execution of that idea. The execution is due to the writer(s) and the director.
Some of the LeJudkins episodes have been in bad parts of the arcs. But a very high percentage of their executions are great (maybe not the second half of Masquerade). The Charah argument in First Fight was controversial. The premise of the fight was part of the story arc. The details of the episode–how Chuck talked to sheep, how Sarah attacked Morgan with her shoe, etc. are probably the credit of the writers. If LeJudkins weren’t the writers for it, I doubt the Volkoff introduction would have been nearly as good.
Most people’s problems with Baby have been about plot holes and “retcons” in the mythology. The holes that were filled, the holes that were created, and the holes that were not touched were mostly part of the mythology. I doubt LeJudkins were told, “Go fill in Sarah’s backstory.” However, I thought the details they managed to fit into 42 minutes were fantastic.
A lot of people may not like what happens in Chuck vs Sarah. The fact that LeJudkins are writing it makes me confident it will be well written.
I always do keep in mind the specific writers(s) is only part of the equation. AA is an excellent example. LeJudkins have been good, but Living Dead is the weakest of the bunch, I suppose just because I dislike the interrogation scene so much.
I expect this will be the darkest episode of the arc. But I’m hopeful with two writers at the helm who love these characters much as I do that the characters themselves will not be assassinated (I hope…)
The big thing is; no cliffie! We will go straight into “Goodbye” and get our resolution quickly. I am VERY pleased about that!
Assuming for the moment that the idea is that Sarah has her brain melted like Morgan did, what would be her ham and mustach moment that returns her memories? Places: the fountain, the beach, their bedroom or things: the picture in her suitcase, the bracelet, the twist tie wedding band?
I like the twist tie wedding band idea. I’ve always hoped they kept them. I know a lot of people have complained about the wedding, but I didn’t care because the practice wedding was so great. It paralleled the proposals. I didn’t need to hear the simple one in the hospital because I heard the almost proposal on the balcony.
In addition to your list, it could be a pocket protector, the Sarah+Chuck. It could also be other senses, like the smell of Chuck’s shirt or the sound of him babbling. To be real corny, it could be a ‘Prince Charming waking Snow White with a kiss’ moment.
jeff i’ll stick with what i said. the vandalized arch way where they carved chuck and sarah.
Those are all good “reminders,” but since everyone keeps talking about roots and coming full circle, I bet they go back even farther somehow and highlight some earlier moments … building up to more recent things. If that’s what it is. Remember Morgan’s mustache sandwich was an earlier memory.
In terms of homages and reminders, I don’t think it can be too much of a 43 minute episode in which there is a final battle with the bad guy and some sort of denouement.
For what it’s worth, I’ve compiled a list of all the locations I remember mentioned or that I know they filmed in during the finale:
–The Buy More
–The Apartment courtyard
–Chuck & Sarah’s apartment
–Castle
–Somewhere on the lot that could be made up to be Germany (Berlin mentioned in articles) Some of this filming went into the night.
–A skydiving facility where two people were filmed skydiving to a beach
–A concert hall (reporters there that day)
–A Weinerlicious
–outside of an office building
–A beach that looks made up to be the Riviera (mentioned as a location in an article)
On the day they filmed at the beach, they had two units going. One unit at the beach. Another at the studio.
There could be others that were not tweeted or mentioned, but that’s pretty extensive list for eight days of filming. I remember them filming at a residence, but that was in Chuck vs. Sarah.
…addendum. There also was a plane set. Forgot about that.
I am not saying they will go there. However, they did set something up with Morgan having sex with Bo and not remembering. What was that for? Fedak also did not have to bring back Shaw and he definitely did not have to have Shaw kiss her. I just do not trust this guy. Even though I agree with you I am just a little uncomfortable of what he might do. Remember Yvonne’s initial response was that she was shocked with is script.
I still doubt the shocked part will have anything to do with Quinn getting down and dirty with Sarah – I’m pretty sure it will have to do with the fight they will likely have – and since they have never actually fought each other physically before, I’m sure that would be a shock to most of the cast let alone Yvonne (No idea about the whole Bo and Morgan thing, but I imagine it could be to do with the whole Alex sleeping with someone when they were separated then finding out Morgan got pretty far with Bo Derek. I think it was just a plot device to firstly move the story along (finding out she worked for Quinn) and secondly just like the whole P.A.N.T.S thing it was likely merely a way for Morlex to evolve a bit.
And she also called it “brave” on the writers part, so I am inclined to trust her at this point. Also, esardi to your point above, they are finishing Chuck’s story in these episodes so they have to give Chuck a significant challenge to defeat. They have chose a psychological and emotinal challenge rather than a physical one. This makes sense since that is what carries greater weight and significance. Also, I personally did not want to see three epilogues as the final episodes of Chuck. They are bringing the series full circle by finishing Chuck’s hero journey. He is nearly home, but has one more challenge to complete before the finish, then he and Sarah can go onto further adventures in the future. Also, no journey is complete without a few scars but the end is more satisfying.
Does anyone know where there is a master list of YS exact quotes from last week? A lot of them were similar. I remember “surprised”, but not “shocked,” which has a much stronger connotation. Of course we are all parsing her words too much…
Wow.
It’s nice to know people are “thrilled to death” about the final 3.
I agree that it will probably be a confrontation with Chuck. More Manchurian candidate stuff then anything else. She did say this in a recent interview. “He takes something away from Chuck and Sarah, and it may not necessarily be something physical.” For a guy who used to have a supercomputer in his brain, this could be really bad news.
So I am guessing that would be her memory. The shock comment occurred in on of her early interviews. I will find the link or comment and post it.
My worry was the Morgan deal. He certainly planted a seed there that I hope was just for Morgan.
Ok this is what she said in one of her early interviews.
When asked about her expectations for the five-year-old series’ capper versus what it actually presented itself to be, the Aussie beauty – perhaps skilled by her time playing a savvy CIA agent – ably sidestepped that “trick” question, saying, “I can’t tell you my expectations, because then I reveal what the finale is not.”
But then, measuring her words with some care, Strahovski went on to share, “I had very specific things that I thought it was going to be, and it turned out to be not what I thought.”
In fact, she says, the final leg of Team Bartowski’s journey “surprised me to the point where I kind of felt like an audience member myself, sitting on the edge of my seat wondering, ‘Oh my gosh, how is this going to get resolved?’”
Wait, there are things to be resolved? Edge-of-seat kinds of things? Should fans prepare to be left hanging? “There will be a satisfying ending,” Strahovski reassures, “but it’s almost slightly, slightly tragic, the lead-up to what happens.”
A well-placed source echoes Strahovski’s intimations, telling TVLine that elements of the finale are, indeed, “pretty shocking.”
Officially, NBC’s synopses for the series-ending hours read, in part, “After a harrowing mission, Sarah returns to Chuck with a huge secret,” then, “Chuck enlists his family, friend and some unexpected allies as he races to stop [villain] Nicholas Quinn (guest star Angus Macfadyen, Braveheart) from destroying everything Chuck has built over the past five years.”
But Strahovski boils it down thusly, and romantically: “We’re going to see a lot of the focus on the Chuck and Sarah love story, which is the heart of the show.”
Thank you esardi – well done and I believe accurate.
So I’ve been reluctant to post this – but with all the spec here leading in the same direction I’d like to point out that DR posted something on July 29th asking the question Will Chuck & Sarah split up in S5? and then asked the question, what if it was due to amnesia.
I commented on that on his blog – he deleted my comment and subsequently banned me for life (an honor this late in the game).
I won’t post the link – as DR said, if people want to find this stuff, they’ll go looking.
Care to share, Peter? I’m pretty sure if the comment got you banned there, I’ll like what you had to say.
Will Chuck and Sarah split up in S5 … no. They won’t go there. It’s not brave or shocking because it’s such TV tripe and it’s been done (in the first 3 seasons, ad nausiam). Plus it couldn’t be resolved as easily as memory loss. I think TPTB want to create some drama between Chuck and Sarah (something I don’t need to see, but it’s such a stock device, they can’t seem to help themselves). This is a way to do it without damaging the characters or the core relationship, because the stress won’t be Chuck or Sarah’s fault. It’s a way for them to eat their cake and still have it.
I just pointed to his blog post & highlighted two lines: Will they split? Is it due to amnesia? It is a spoiler (whatever you may think, DR is VERY accurate) and his comment was if people wanted to know spoilers they’d go looking for them.
Pretty much. If Sarah acts differently or goes after Chuck, it’s not really Sarah who’s doing it, but Amnesia!Sarah, and we’ll just look past it because it’s not like it was really her to begin with. That way they can have all the drama between them that they want, have Ellie bring most of her memories back or whatever, and have it all work out in the end.
Yeah, but it would be nice if it actually worked out a good many minutes *before* the end, for their fans’ sakes at least. But, hell, these are the same people who thought that the last 3-5 minutes of 3.13 (which was, I believe, then due to be the end of the series) would serve as a wonderful pay-off to all those who sat through the (then) entire Season 3 ! So I’m not getting my hopes up at all.
I almost forgot the very end.. which had them in bed, making dirty and closing the laptop on Beckman. Yeah.. that was their way of a ‘send-off’ when it was supposed to be a finale. Not a fan of like.. 2 minutes at all! Then again, it did lead to “Honeymoon” so..
Hoping TPTB learned their lesson though of how to write a love-letter to the fans is just.. yeah. Sigh.
To be fair, we did hear that 3.13 was changed when they found out they got the back 9, which led directly into Honeymooners.
See, with all the late extensions, we’ll never know for sure what the mid-season, “could have been the finale” episodes were supposed to be.
I think we can only base it on true season finales. S2 “to be continued…” S3 Ring Part II & S4’s cliffhanger. Now remember, a good part of the end of these episodes are preludes to the next season.
We won’t have that now.
Unfortunately : /
ok color me confused about 3.13. sarah admits to chuck early on that she loves him, she just doesn’t say it. sure they don’t jump into bed right away but the did get it out of the way pretty early on in that episode.
DR is VERY accurate I don’t think so. From everything I’ve ever read of his (and it’s been a year) he is very misleading, and intentionally so, with intent to inflame and provoke. Usually he is just grossly misleading, but he outright lied about the proposal being put off until the back half of S4. We’ll see, of course, but I don’t put stock in anything he says.
Yes, he is provocative. Yes, he uses “spoiler teasers” that can inflame those who are inclined to be inflamed. But he is accurate. Do people take what he has to say to the worst possible conclusion – often – but when you look at what he has to say, after the fact, well, he is accurate.
And as far as: “he outright lied about the proposal being put off until the back half of S4.”
I don’t think that’s accurate, but wouldn’t mind being proven wrong.
I’m not saying anyone has to like him, but his track record is really good. That’s all.
I agree. Sadly he’s gotten a lot of flak because he pulls no punches when it comes to other sections of the fandom, but he does prove to be quite accurate, even if he misleads. He has to mislead, for the most part, before episodes air.. or he’d be spoiling things outright, and make those who want to hunt spoilers down.. have no fun, yanno?
That’s all I’ll say about that, though.
That is what is so disheartening about this situation. Morgan had the intersect became a jerk but never lost who he was. Then you have Shaw, for two friggin years he had had the intersect and what? Good as new as a matter of fact better than before. Not only did he not lose who he was but supposedly came with a brilliant plan to destroy Chuck and Sarah. Now you have Sarah, she has the intersect for just a short while and she will lose all her memory of Chuck? Really?
Sorry if I have said this before but Fedak SUCKS!! This guy really does not care about the fans of the show. He was upset with us because with thought that Mask and Fake Name were the worst episodes he ever put on. I know why he has not said anything, and that is because he has a tendency of making a bad situation worse.
I remember an interview he did after the Mask fiasco where he said that Shaw was the perfect partner for Sarah. So anything he does at the end will not surprise me in the least.
Agreeing with Peter on DR’s teasers. They are very accurate. I don’t recall the thing about the proposal at all.
As someone else said, he tends to hide the actual spoiler in language that doesn’t often sound like a spoiler. It’s misleading for a reason. The people who fly off the handle about the language are the ones who tend to jump to the worse scenario first.
It actually can be fun to decipher what he’s saying, if you know the patterns.
What dkd said 😉
And as an example, he recently said in response to some of the specs about Sarah – “it COULD be worse.”
So many ways to take that.
Saying Chuck and Sarah will “break up” due to amnesia is such a weird statement to me. I mean sure, Sarah may run off on her own agenda due to the Intersect for a period of time. But they’re not going to divorce. Once the Intersect is removed Chuck (and friends?) will work on restoring her memories and the relationship. That just doesn’t sound like a break up to me. The word choice is deliberately inflammatory to the point of being inaccurate.
esardi, I don’t think being disheartened is called for, yet. That time may come (as intended!) before the last half hour of the last episode, but not yet.
And you yourself said exactly why! You see, Morgan did lose himself. The moment he looked at Chuck and said “We are not friends!”, he was gone. In fact, his masterful demonstration of fighting skills was the most un-Morgan like thing we’ve seen in five seasons, at least until we saw his seduction skills working on Bo Derek 😉 in flash back. Being pantsed was very Morgan like. Dramatically telling Chuck off was not.
Honestly, because Sarah “forgetting” about Chuck is so much like what happened with Morgan, I’ll be surprised that they go that route. Losing their relationship is too much “Been there, done that” for this show.
Now, there’s a perfect example.:
“Saying Chuck and Sarah will “break up” due to amnesia is such a weird statement to me.”
He didn’t say “break up”. He said “split up”. People read one thing and think another. This happened last year, too. “Split up” can mean a physical separation for a time. He used the same phrase to describe Gobbler and people made the same assumptions that he mean “break up”.
Also, he clearly said in that spoiler article that it was something that was on the “writer’s board”, as in something that was just an idea at the time.
Dave, I didn’t look through this thread thoroughly, but I don’t think “break up” was used. At least, I didn’t use it.
I said split up – which we know could mean a lot of things including a split due to amnesia.
I certainly don’t think they will divorce. I do think we will have a happy ending. I think the road leading to it will be rougher than what we thought two months ago – and I for one am glad I’m prepared for that.
What Dave said. Yes, it’s true that sometimes, IF you parse his (DR’s) words very carefully and twist them enough, they are true. However, they are intentionally inflammatory, and the amount of contortion and parsing required to make them true renders them inaccurate. People jump to the worst conclusion first, because that’s exactly where he points them. Example: before Phase 3, he said, “Sarah doesn’t like her new boyfriend.” That from the scene where she punches out scar-face and says, “Anybody else want to be my boyfriend?” Asside from the use of the word boyfriend, he was wildly misleading, intentionally inflammatory, and totally inaccurate. We had a reader at the time who was absolutely beside himself and threatened to quit the show. Did he? Don’t know, but he quit the blog. Some people think that kind of taunting is fun. I think it’s cruel.
Peter, I am also glad for the heads up and grateful that we’ve gotten it from Yvonne.
I would much rather get it from Yvonne, who is sympathetic to fans and isn’t trying to mislead us with ambiguous language. She trying to be genuinely honest without actually telling us what’s going to happen. DR is not genuinely honest, and he certainly doesn’t come across as sympathetic to fans. He deliberately misleads with ambiguous language in order to lead fans to think the worst.
I’m coming down hard on him, I guess, and I don’t have anything against his defenders. I don’t want you to feel that way at all. I just have no use for his style.
Okay, I don’t read his blog I don’t know what he said. If I got “break-up” when someone said “split-up” that’s my bad. But either way the language is inflammatory and I have no use for such talk. It’s playing word games with the intent of upsetting certain fans which I consider a very low thing to do.
Yeah, very true. We aren’t sure of the mid-season ‘finales’, but the S3/S4 finales with the cliffhangers.. (S4’s being the worst if you counted Morgan, and without it.. was meh anyway) we have some sort of idea. I’d just picture.. if it ended with S4, it would have ended with Chuck and Sarah riding off in the sunset, so to speak, as a married couple.
Perhaps as Chuck fans, we’re just sweating the small stuff too much. Our fanbase does have a habit of going off the deep end, and really.. when it comes to some of the Chuck/Sarah moments, they have handled them fairly well. I don’t think they’ll stick us with a terrible “Sopranos” like ending. Just gotta have…faith, I suppose. (Shoutout to you know who.)
I think that is exactly right katsumaro.
@Dave
The query in regards to ‘break-up’ between Chuck and Sarah wasn’t actually worded as “break-up’, but as ‘split up’.. which can mean different things. A break-up signifies just that.. a break up, a loss of love, wanting to get away from it. A split up is different. A mission could split them up, after all.. or in this case, possibly amnesia. Yeah, they’ll still be married by law, and it will probably work out in the end, but they could still technically be split up until things are resolved and they come together, stronger than ever.
Thanks Peter,
I have been positive for some time that Sarah will have to get Amnesia to fight Chuck. Now if that is what Chuck Vs Sarah is then fine, just get Sarah back before the end. The sarah that remembers her husband not some new start.
I just thought of it what if The Goodbye is Sarah saying goodbye to Chuck. Of course we all know it won’t end that way. No 50 first dates though.
Yeah, and to add to this since there’s still I can’t edit my post.. I’d be fine with that if Chuck vs Sarah is both literal (a fight scene or whatever) and figurative with Chuck working to bring Sarah out of her amnesic state and back to the side where she belongs.
Granted.. it’d be odd seeing them go at it considering I don’t think we’ve seen them fight outside of a spar.. ever, and I’m fairly certain Chuck, a man who hasn’t really ‘hit’ a girl, even on a mission, won’t be able to fight his own wife. I’m thinking this is going to rule out the whole baby thing, though. Her secret from 5.12 is probably going to have to do with her memory.
Gah so many thoughts rushing through my head. D:
Rac I was thinking the same thing to. What if it is goodbye is between Chuck and Sarah. Boy talk about a slap in the face to the fans! Peter I just have a feeling that this is going to be rushed. I have noticed the way Yvonne has toned down her comments from shaocking to brave. I have a feeling that Fedak made a call somewhere complaining. However, from her comments above you can plainly see that see did not like the direction they went in the end.
Yeah.. and when your most popular actress who’s never really been on the front lines making a scene about the series.. makes a comment like that isn’t a fan, that doesn’t really bode well. Sure the ending may be ‘satisfying’ but I can’t be the only one who doesn’t want a ‘satisfying’ ending. I wanted a ‘good’ ending. There’s a difference, lol.
I think it’s going to be packed and rushed too – typical of all the season finales from S2 on. I don’t think Fedak made a call – really, what did she say that was so bad and what could he do? Chuck is getting more action on line than it has all season, and that is a good thing.
I think we’re going to get a lot of “official” information. interview etc in the next 9 days that will fuel the fire much more than Yvonne’s comments.
And yeah, it would be “slightly tragic” if the Goodbye is between Chuck and Sarah.
Yvonne never used the word “shocking.” It was a different “inside source” according to the article, that used the words “pretty shocking.” Come on get the facts straight and keep it in balance.
Yvonne said “surprised me to the point where I kind of felt like an audience member myself, sitting on the edge of my seat wondering, ‘Oh my gosh, how is this going to get resolved?’” Then she said, “There will be a satisfying ending,” Strahovski reassures, “but it’s almost slightly, slightly tragic, the lead-up to what happens.” And finally, “We’re going to see a lot of the focus on the Chuck and Sarah love story, which is the heart of the show.”
OK. Let’s put some boundaries around our panic. I’ll work backwards.
There will be a satisfying ending. That categorically precludes a goodbye between Chuck and Sarah. Yvonne knows the fans well enough that I don’t think she would reassure us of a satisfying ending, if it were a CS goodbye. I would say it pretty much precludes an ending where there’s still memory loss to recuperate, but I suppose you can leave it on the very edge of the table, if you want. For me, based on everybody’s “satisfying end” proclamation, it’s off the table.
The lead-up to what happens is slightly, slightly tragic. The lead-up, not the end. These are words I would use to prepare people for some drama, conflict, sadness, perhaps a bit of angst, but not the end of the world for them (double use of slightly tones down the word tragic). To me, it means it’s going to be serious, but they’ll get through it. There’ll be some stuff that some of us probably won’t like for a bit.
There will be a lot of focus on the Chuck and Sarah love story. There are tragic love stories (Romeo and Julliet or Love Story), but I wouldn’t call their endings satisfying, more like sad … or tragic. So the focus on CS love story, coupled with the promise of a satisfying ending, is something I’m looking forward to … but I’m pretty sure there will be tears on various levels. But there could be chemistry and heart warmth, too. 🙂
Thanks for restoring the balance, Thinkling.
We’re all parsing the words too much. I’ve seen a few posts where someone says they want a “good” ending. So they won’t be satisfied unless it is good. Since Yvonne said the ending is satisfying, by the transitive property, the ending will be good. (Math IS useful in life.)
Let me try over parsing something else: “pretty shocking.” Yvonne is pretty. Maybe she takes 10K volts. That would be pretty shocking. Casey is safe because he’s “not pretty”, at least according to Chuck.
thinkling she also said this in a IGN interview
Strahovski: It was not what I expected. Oh man, the lead up to the finale is I feel somewhat tragic. There’s a moment of tragedy in there. We sort of focus on the Chuck and Sarah story, which is sort of the heart of Chuck. I think there is a satisfying end.
Very true, thinkling. That’s the part I always preached about. The only ‘slightly, slightly tragic’ part that Yvonne mentioned was the lead-up. Then again, you also have to remember what she said was measured.. and possibly just something to keep fans from going nuts, even though they already are. It could be worse than she’s saying, or it could be better. We won’t know for another ten days. Or perhaps a few days with 5.11.
Of course there will be tears. We’ve gone through all these emotional states with this cast from S1’s pilot, all the way until now with most of us sticking with it.. so many ups and sadly, some downs to accompany them as with any show, but we were lucky our show lasted five years, and didn’t get canned earlier like it was close to be all those times.
I’m generally the more positive Chuck fan, though.. especially on twitter, trying to calm people and have them look at the bright side of things, so I hope I can remain positive until the finale. I’m not a huge fan of the ‘amnesia’ plot as it’s sort of.. old and played out, but if they can somehow work it to where it has a satisfying, romantic, and powerful conclusion before the actual last minute of the finale, and give us time to.. ‘adjust’, so to speak.. I’d be 100% okay with that.
Jeff, i agree with you on the words. it depends on personal choice what they consider good. i’ll take a plot that makes sense, is exciting and ends with the baddie getting taken down. i don’t care where the characters end up so whether or not they are together is not a deal breaker.
others have said loud and clear as long as they are standing tall and together at the end it will be a good ending and it doesn’t matter what happens before that, but if they are not together fully then it will be a bad ending. some are ok with something in between.
it really will be interesting to see what the results are.
Gotta remember, it’s only the build-up to the ending that’s ‘slightly, slightly tragic’
I don’t think “Goodbye” will be between Sarah and Chuck. At least I hope not. I think it may involve Chuck and Sarah finally getting out of that house they’re in now and either getting into another, or just leaving in general. Not real sure on that one.
The goodbye will be a fakeout. She won’t leave but in her amnesia mind she thinks her mission in Burbank is over. It is up to Chuck from preventing her to leave and remeber their life together. Gosh this is so fanficcy and not In a good way.
And sadly I could see that potentially being in, and we’ll get maybe the last 5-10 minutes of the show with Chuck finally triggering something and her memories slowly trickling back (in a montage-like state) and a tearful ‘reunion’ of sorts. That’d seem just like Faildak and the finales of late.
I think the primary “goodbye” of the title will be about Devon and Ellie moving away for a new job; double meaning because it’s also the end of the series.
I think the worst ending we’re actually likely to see is Sarah not regaining memories until the very very end. I have long hoped for a longer more rewarding denouement, but I think that is not going to happen. But that’s okay; as I’ve said elsewhere, my minimum requirement is Chuck and Sarah still standing, still together, and happy about it. I think I’m very likely to get at least that.
Dave, i guess i’m just different than most. NOT saying this will be the case BTW. if the next 2.75 episodes are full of angst/bad times/memory loss, a sad journey so to speak. having .25 of an episode that is uplifting is not fair trade to me. just like 3.13 did not make up for the mess of the first 12.
Right. 3.13 as a whole didn’t make up for 3.1-3.12, but at least 3.13 was good. Season 5 hasn’t been a disaster like the first half of Season 3, so they don’t have much to do to ‘make anything up’ to us as fans.. but I do have some faith that it won’t be 2.75 episodes of drama/angst with just .25 of goodness. Maybe they’ll make whatever this storyline is.. a bit lighthearted and fun instead of full-on angsty/drama mode. After all.. back during the whole Gobbler/Sarah undercover arc, fans were quick to jump on the angst train because “Oh god, Sarah ignored Chuck’s call!11one” and it turned out to be not such a big deal at all. Let’s not sweat this.
sorry one last thing, when i say not satisfying i mean for the arc not the season or the end of the show. just wanted to clarify that.
No, I gotcha. Totally understood. 😀
Well a few things are different between this and S3. For starters, most of S3 was a downer with payoff really only coming at the very end of 3.13. So more or less 12 episodes of relationship angst for less than a full episode of pay off.
While S5 has been almost all pay off so far, with a maximum of 3 episodes left to be angst laden. And we know it won’t even be all of that. We saw a preview for 5.11 with Chuck and Sarah still together and in love (health and mission related angst is different from relationship angst to me!), except for likely being separated at the end. 5.12 will likely be very angst filled; but it is immediately followed by 5.13, which will likely resolve relationship problems by the end.
So while I would have preferred a fun Chuck and Sarah vs. the world sort of finale, I don’t think this ending will be unacceptable. There’s a good chance it will never be a favorite of mine and I won’t want to re-watch endlessly like I do with Baby or Business Trip; but I don’t believe it will “ruin” the series for me either, and I expect Chuck and Sarah will be together and happy about it in the end.
That’s pretty much how I see it, Dave … the contrast between S3 and S5. S3 had a lot to make up for and the CRM was their own fault. S5 will have only one episode to make up for and the relationship breakdown can likely be blamed on Intersect problems.
Still, I really am hoping for a series finale that I can rewatch, rather than rewatch selectively. The mid S4 final arc could have gone either way. If Push Mix hadn’t resolved things satisfactorily, it would have damaged the rewatch value of the whole arc. But it was fine, and I thoroughly enjoy rewatching the entire arc. I think 5.12 will likely be rougher than Gobbler, but that’s not to say it couldn’t be fixed satisfactorily in 5.13.
Are you actually banned for life? Haha. I didn’t take that literally. Figured it was just a joke.
I didn’t see that comment you made, though. So I guess those saying memory loss/amnesia are going to be correct and it’s up to us to see how TPTB handle this. Guess they couldn’t finish the series without having Chuck and Sarah face off with one another.
nope. in fact it’s one of the things i predicted would happen. my guess is her secret in 12 is to kill chuck. don’t add that one to my list though, i list that one as possible not probable.
Yeah, I dunno if ‘kill’ will actually be brought into this. I think this villain is gonna be some sort of tie-in with Chuck’s family if he was indeed supposed to be the ‘real’ intersect before Bryce shipped it off elsewhere. Maybe she’s supposed to bring him in or something.
kat…me either that’s why its just possible. any scenario is possible at this point, kill, capture, divorce, pregnant and the list goes on.
Crap that is alot of locations. Seems pretty jam packed. If Sarah had amnesia I would rather have the episode slow it down and concentrate on the slow beats.
I guess we know now that the house with the red door was just a fairy tale.
What if Sarah was told that she was sent to Burbank and that her mission is to be his wife. That is her secret. She thinks she is on a mission and waiting for the order to assasinate the mark. But as she gets to know him she starts to fall in love all over again. Sarah can’t pull the trigger and then he enlists everyone help to get Sarah to remember her past.
Fedak told IGN: “I’m really excited and I’m a little bit scared about what we’ve come up with [for the series finale]. But I think that’s a good thing.” Oh no Fedak is frightened of the Finale. Oh boy! Lol
Let me try over parsing again… Fedak is a little bit scared, so he is outside of his comfort zone. A lot of people don’t trust him and don’t like his normal comfort zone, so those people will be happy. That makes sense. Right? Doesn’t it? 😉
The person posting on here as dkd is known as mediasavant on the chuckgasmic site. Just to let people know she is a huge DR suck up. She also regularly posts comments on his site that mock shippers of the type who post here.
I’m not sure what that has to do with anything really. I post on a lot of boards. Certainly doesn’t make me a suck up.
Has she said anything that isn’t true? or is it that people don’t like what she has to say? If that’s the case, it’s ok – but a personal attack is unwarranted.
IMO
I completely agree with Peter. That.. was so uncalled for, Carlos. 😦 Just because DKD posts elsewhere.. it doesn’t really mean said person is a suck-up, and let’s be honest. Our fandom as Chuck fans, and ‘shippers’ in general can tend to take things to the extreme, and it is comical at times..
That’s right – and remember “it COULD be worse!) 😉
It should be noted that DR himself likes the Chuck/Sarah relationship and doesn’t mind the romantic elements of the show at all.
What he finds annoying are what he calls “crazy shippers” who (in his view) only care about the romance and find everything else secondary.
That maybe be true but it is what drives this show. Just how many people would watch Jeffster or that idiot Morgan. Chuck and Sarah are abot 80 percent of the show. That is why this board is so active now.
Oh I agree, I was just saying that’s how he feels.
That’s actually not his definition of a “Crazy shipper”. A crazy shipper is someone who is more extreme than that. Defined here: http://geekfurious.blogspot.com/2012/01/21-days-of-chuck-day-2-to-ship-not-to.html
Carlos, like 99.44% of our commenters, dkd has been well spoken and to the point here, and has been for a long time now. That counts for a lot with me, so I’m not particularly concerned with what’s been said elsewhere.
Heh! I’m a frickin’ lunatic on some political sites, myself. 😉
I realize that DR has been controversial in the Chuck community, but he’s also been a strong voice and a leader. He’s said a lot of things I don’t agree with, sometimes in a manner I don’t care for. But he’s also been knowledgeable and even a fun read. I’d like this to not be a place where he’s bad-mouthed. There’s just no point to it anymore.
Completely agreed. I haven’t posted here much lately (except the past week or so) and generally post as Wyndzorz (my google account) over on DR’s site.. but there’s no need in bashing anyone, especially in our fandom. We’ve gotta be there for each other, and stick up for one another!
And crazy shippers are indeed slightly scary. Fear them! Good points though, joe.
for what it’s worth, mediasavant has always been very insightful in these kinds of things so I’m not at all opposed to him/her sharing his/her opinion on this site.
Confirmation of the breakdown of Chuck and Sarah.
Speculate away. http://zacharylevifan.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pid=60499&fullsize=1
But, did you read the Wienerlicious part? They are working together.
I did but is that season 1 CIA Sarah or Wife Sarah?
CIA Sarah, I’m afraid.
This is a quote from the writer, so it may not be an accurate description of the plot:
“His character, computer nerd-turned-spy Chuck Bartowski, and wife Sarah (Yvonne Strahovski) have tracked the show’s final big baddie, Nicholas Quinn (“Braveheart” star Angus Macfadyen) to the local Wienerlicious in Berlin.
It says “wife”.
I also read ‘wife’ Sarah.. is that incorrect?
What I meant that she might still be his wife, but mentally she’s the CIA Sarah.
Right, right.. but where did it make it seem it was “CIA Sarah”.. so to speak? I dunno. It’s all just so confusing. Think I’m better off just waiting for the episodes and judging then. D: Then again, the writer could be wrong. Who knows!
No problem, jam. I figured you were speculating. With how people are misquoting and freaking out, I thought the exact quote might calm some people,
The quote really doesn’t answer Rac2873’s question, which assumes some kind of regression, brain washing, or straight memory loss, all of which are also speculation.
Indeed. For all we know, when they go after Quinn, it could be after Sarah is “better”, could be as Sarah is getting a hang of who she is again.. or it could just be Season 1 Sarah all together. We won’t know, sadly.. until the episodes air.
The important thing is that they are working together. It’s not “Chuck vs. Sarah”. It’s a positive sign. As for the rest, it isn’t worrying me.
I’m intrigued by the line about them trying to kill Quinn. Sarah, I can see. But, Chuck is usually the “let’s outwit him rather than kill him” type. If the wording is correct, what changes Chuck’s demeanor? Did Quinn push Chuck across the line that he crossed when he “killed” Shaw.
The synopsis may not be completely accurate. Perhaps Chuck wants to capture while Sarah wants to kill. On the other hand, damaging Sarah’s brain may be grounds to make Chuck want to kill. I know if someone made my wife forget me I wouldn’t be thinking much restraint towards them…
This is the last episode, so it is Chuck vs the Goodbye, not Chuck vs. Sarah.
Not surprising, we knew (well, we were quite sure) something like this was going to happen. Just seeing that printed there will make people anxious, and that’s exactly what they want viewers to be.
Posters mistranslating breakdown into break-up in 3… 2… 1…
Also, it’s only fair to provide the first page link for context:
http://zacharylevifan.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pid=60500&fullsize=1
It says Chuck and Sarah have tracked down Quinn *together*. It also talks about the Wienerlicious.
Actually, Sarah’s statement could apply to Ring, Subway/Ring 2, the Balcony/Gobbler/Push Mix arc, and American Hero/Other Guy.
Thanks for that, Jeff. It certainly does help me.. and seeing how it’s Chuck and Sarah going after Quinn *together*.. is that giving us false hope in hoping they may actually complete this last mission as a team instead of one of them being incapacitated?! I hope not. I wanna see them kick ass as Team Bartowski.
So apparently they DO have a Wienerlicious in Germany. Bad business strategy is bad!
“Posters mistranslating breakdown into break-up in 3… 2… 1…”
I won’t do that myself, something like this was to be expected.
Still, I hope Sarah actually regains her memories well before the episode is over, but sadly I do not think that is the case.
http://zacharylevifan.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pid=60498&fullsize=1
I thought the twitter pic with the thumbs down almost looked like Ellie was wearing tactical gear. From this, you can see she clearing is not.
Yep, she’s not. And Chuck’s wearing his good ol jacket, while Morgan’s in tactical gear. Sarah’s not really dressed for combat though, now is she? Leaves me to wonder..
@Jam: As for the bit about Sarah regaining all of her memories well before the episode is over.. yeah. I hope Chuck and Sarah are going after Quinn with her memories in tact, and not just because Sarah remembers herself as an agent and nothing more. So many things that could happen before the finale, though! I have no idea where they are taking this.
I must say I didn’t want the last scene to be at the Buy More, Chuck and Sarah at their *dream home* or something like that sounds better to me.
Of course, it’s entirely possible, even probable that they just shot that scene last and change the order in editing.
Well, if the dream home is used.. at all, I could see it being the second to last scene with Chuck and Sarah leaving to go *to* the Buy More and wrap it up there since it was the heart of the show for much of the time. Then again.. who really knows right now.
jam, I took ZL’s comment to mean the last scene they shot at the Buy More set. This was some time before the TV Guide writer interviewed them. They were still filming another scene, so it was not the last scene shot. It may or may not be the last scene in the show.
Typically scenes that require more setup are filmed last. The Buy More and apartment scenes were probably done early.
This interview was done back in early December. The cast was more emotional since it was the last week of shooting. That probably colors YS’s comments.
Yvonne posted the day after she had filmed the last scene of the series. It was about mid-way through the week of filming. On the day she was referring to there were two filming locations and probably two units working. One was at a beach. I don’t know where the other location one was. No actors could be seen in the picture I saw of the beach location. So, I couldn’t suss out where Yvonne was filming that she said was the last scene.
She is his wife but CIA Sarah because we know that Chuck has one more mission to accomplish. If he got his wife back then killing Quinn would be the final mission. I think Sarah is leaving and he must get her to remember before she does.
Remember folks if they follow the Morgansect story idea she will be normal Sarah for much of it and then go all douchy while beginning to lose her memories. But I think the pain stuff is connected more towards Ring II Intersect issues than necessarily Morgansect issues. He brain melts. But I see them having Sarah relearn them with Ellie and Chuck’s help. Epic love will conquer all and I expect it to maybe the roughest ride yet but the ending will be satisfying if just not long enough.
Yup, that’s exactly what I expect Uplink,
“Epic love will conquer all”
Yep. S1 CIA Sarah fell in love with Chuck in about two seconds, before defusing bombs with computer viruses. Without a mission, CIA rules, and Casey’s interruption, Chuck might have gotten lucky after that first date. There’s nothing to worry about.
Are you talking about 5.11? Because from the promos I think that is when it happens. What is not clear is whether she is captured by Quinn at the end of 5.10. It sure seems that is what happens. The synopsis for 5.11 states she comes back to Chuck and has a big secret. Therefore, the Manchurian candidate type would be in play.
I have a feeling that at the end of 5.11 is when she makes her play and betrays Chuck. I am not sure if the pictures we saw in that article are from 5.12 or 5.13. The way she is looking at him is either as agent Walker or bad Sarah. I hope I am wrong but it seems that way.
Esardi, we just watched 5.10 (Chuck vs Bo). We have 5.11-13 left. Bullet Train (5.11) looks like they are pretty much fighting together until Sarah gets taken. Chuck vs Sarah (5.12) is the one where she comes back with a secret. Then Goodbye is the big finale, where they resolve everything and give us a satisfactory ending.
esardi it’s the end of 10 where she gets the intersect. the promo’s for 11 show her with chuck. 11 will have her and casey rescuing chuck on the bullet train. like the promo for 10 showed casey yelling walker no came at the end of 10, i’m willing to bet the last part of the promo for bullet train where she collapses while chuck looks on from another car is at the end of 11. this is where she gets caught by quinn. her return in 12 is after he lets her go or she escapes, thus the sarah returns from a harrowing mission.
That or when she comes back from her ‘harrowing mission’, it’s after the intersect’s played tricks on her mind/messed with it, and her secret is she’s slowly losing her memories. That’s obviously waaay out there speculation, but we’ll see. A shame the pregnancy test was pretty much nothing but a red herring 😦
Sorry guys I meant to say 5.11 she gets captured. I think she betrays him at the end of 5.12.
Of course we are all assuming she gets captured. It could easily be what Katsumaro is saying and she is just losing her memories of them.
Right. Sure, she could get captured by Quinn and he could use the intersect to twist what Sarah knows and sic her after Chuck.. maybe to lure Chuck back to him, or something.. (and they meet at the Wienerlicious) or it could be something else completely. We won’t know until the episodes hit!
Yeah, all of this, plausible as a lot of it seems, is speculation. Sarah returning from a harrowing mission could just be coming home from Bullet Train with Chuck. She may figure that she needs to keep the Intersect to save them and keep it a secret that the Intersect is destroying her (like Chuck did in Tooth), and it ends up nearly destroying everything they have.
Thinkling, it will be hard for her to keep it a secret that it’s destroying her. chuck sees her crash to the ground holding her head and screaming and he tells her just don’t flash, she says i’ll try. he already knows it’s having a bad affect on her.
Yeah he sees her go to the ground, when they get home he gives her his watch to fix that problem not knowing that this intersect also has the brain melting problem. Again I think that the Chuck and Sarah problems are going to be one aspect to a very big story that has a lot of moving parts and travels at a great speed.
Wouldn’t Chuck immediately call Beckman and ask her for the device or glasses to remove the intersect? I just do not see him keeping the intersect in Sarah. That would only happen if she is captured returns and says that the intersect was removed by Quinn. The secret could be she still has the intersect and we all think it was removed.
Or maybe the “CIA Sarah” is correct, and Quinn caused Chuck’s wife Sarah to ‘go away’ with the whole memory loss and it’s pushed Chuck to the brink like in S3? Then again, that’d pretty much throw every single thing Chuck’s preached about not wanting to be ‘that guy’ out the window.. so I really don’t see him going after Quinn in a mindset to ‘kill’ unless something super extreme goes down. There’s gotta be something about this Quinn character that we haven’t seen. I still think he’s got a link to the Bartowskis and with Marry perhaps coming back.. we’ll see that connection.
But yeah, I can’t see Chuck pull the trigger of a gun that’d actually kill Quinn. Just wouldn’t be him.
Er, this post was meant at DKD. Curse the reply bit D:
Not only Mary but Hadley comes back. The picturs from the link Rac2873 clearly shows Mary and Hadley working with them.
. http://zacharylevifan.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pid=60499&fullsize=1
That’s an old pic, it’s from the “First Fight” I believe.
Hartley. But yeah, I’m pretty sure that picture is from First Fight, when C&S are indeed about to have their “first fight”. 😉
Yeah you can tell by how long Sarah’s hair is.
that pic is for the list of stars that appeared on chuck over the years.
Jam when they did a wrap and everyone was saying good bye to the fans I did see Linda Hamilton there. However, I did not see Tomothy Dalton.
It still seems like a cool possibility of Hartley making an appearance. But we really don’t KNOW anything.
Seems unlikely to me, surely we would have heard about Timothy Dalton guest appearance by now.
Besides, Hartley is just a regular, harmless old man now.
I think there is a surprise guest star they haven’t mentioned yet. Someone (Yvonne?) said more than one person come back for the finale.
I tend to agree with you all about Chuck not wanting to ‘kill’ Quinn for the reasons said. TV Guide could be wrong on that point. Chuck would only do it in a situation where he has no choice. He either kills or other people die.
Guest starts are normally in the synopses, unless it is a big surprise. Scott Bakula was left out of First Fight, but that was voice over only and was a last minute change. It might just be Alex, Gertrude, or Beckman. If they are not in 5.11 or 5.12, they would be sort of be coming back. Gertrude would have been gone for 3 episodes–Beckman for 5.
If they are keeping guest star secret, it should be a fun surprise.
Jam you really cannot say he is a harmless old man. He worked with Orion.
Hartley was one of the earliest developers of the Intersect, so it may make sense to bring help either to help remove it from Sarah or to help recover her damaged memories/personality. Also they kept Brandon Routh pretty secret until NBC spilled the beans two weeks out.
I’m not saying I expect Timothy Dalton to be back. Only that Yvonne suggested some surprise returns and he would be on the short list. I think Carina or Zondra (yes I know the actress is working on a new show) are possibilities for a quick appearance also. I look forward to whatever they have in store!
How epic would it be if one of the surprise guests is Scott Bakula – maybe just a video message or something telling him about Quinn and the fact that he knew about him or something and maybe how to stop him. would also be nice to see Mary’s reaction too.)
I hadn’t thought of that Lappers, but yeah, a video message from Orion (or Bryce, slightly less cool, but still…) would be neat. As long as it isn’t another resurrection.
Could be quite easy to hide – film from an undisclosed location (especially if it’s a video message)
Man the hype for the finale is starting to get to me. ARGHHHHHHH!!!!!!!! I can honestly imagine a huge promo after Fridays episode – like they did for the season 3 finale.
Just spitballing here, but maybe she’s lost her memories, goes after Chuck, who goes after Quinn. Quinn legs it to Berlin where Chuck gets trapped in the Wienerlicious. He fights Sarah here (thus Yvonne’s stunt double being there) all the while trying to jog her memory. She finally gets it back during the fight, they reconcile, go after Quinn, take him out and go back home to do whatever it is they’ll be doing.
Seems like the most obvious theory – hopefully it’ll be a little more filled out than that. 🙂
I’m kind of curious why Quinn heads off to a weinerlicious in Berlin??
he probably just heads back to berlin and due to chucks (show) desire to go back in the past on a regular basis, the weinerlicious has to make a return.
Lappers84 isn’t it obvious he has heard what a great cook Sarah was when working there and wants to try one of her hot dogs.
Sounds good Aerox, however, something happens in 5.12 that hurts their relationship.
If I had to guess, I’d suggest the timeline goes something like this:
– Sarah goes a bit crazy in 5×12, might even fight Chuck etc but they manage to snap her out of it before the episode finishes. She still suffers from amnesia but is willing to help Chuck.
– In 5×13 they work together to take down Quinn, and Sarah’s memories will hopefully start returning during this episode and she’ll be back to her old self before the end (I hope!).
jam I tend to agree with Aerox about one thing in particular. If I had to guess, Chuck will be fighting Quinn and losing and just about when Quinn is going to take him out, Sarah snaps out of it and saves Chuck.
As long as it’s not too close to the end – We need one last ‘I love you’ to each other before it ends. Maybe they say it before their last encounter with Quinn.
I think that’s an excellent spec Jam. It might even be a little fun (like on re-watch, first time will be brutal!) to see Sarah as S1 Sarah trying to relate to her “husband” Chuck. But that fun is totally contingent on everything being alright in the end.
Esardi and Lappers both excellent thoughts!
Yeah, jam, that would be a good way to do it. I’m hoping that the inner conflict is over by the end of 12, even if there are some residual effects to to work out.
At no time during the TV Guide article were the words “gamechanger” or “epic” uttered. 🙂
http://www.tvline.com/2012/01/ask-ausiello-spoilers-ncis-greys-glee-house-how-i-met-your-mother-gossip-girl/
Zachary Levi breaks down the two-hour swan song thusly: “The first hour is super-intense drama and action and some tears are shed. And the second half also has some drama, but there’s a lot of comedy, too.”
——
That gives me some hope that the most intense stuff is resolved well before the finale ends.
Elsewhere, DR is making comments that surely have people speculating again:
“Though, if you think about it… I have let this whole “amnesia” thing go on for a while without deleting any of it. And I never spoil major plot points so………….”
What does that mean? No idea. Misleading? Perhaps. I’m not sure what else could really threaten the relationship.
I read what Zac said about the finale. That quells my worries some, and makes me believe it won’t all lead to the final minutes until it’s resolved.. so thank goodness for that. D: I’m guessing (still speculating here) that the super-intense drama has to do with Quinn.. along with the actions, and then if (a big if) Chuck and Sarah duke it out.. tears will be shed when Sarah realizes what she’s done in terms of fighting her husband. I could see it playing out like that, and then the second half is repairing all that.. some drama here and there, and lovable comedy.
As for DR and the amnesia.. hrm. That’s interesting. My guess, honestly.. is there’s just way too much ‘amnesia’ talk over there to delete it all, Haha. I know Peter mentioned he deleted a reference in which he talked about it before with Chuck and Sarah ‘splitting up’ sort of talk.. hm.
BIG relief to hear there’s some comedy in the final episode. One of my big fears was the “funny” was over. Hopefully its not all dark comedy!
I sense that fandom of late is like a ball in a pinball machine. One interview gets people worried. Ball goes through the bottom. Next interview makes them feel better. Ping. Score! Another interview sounds like a downer. Ball goes through the bottom. Next interview sounds better. Ping. Score!
What do the next ten days hold? Will people need medication by the end? 🙂
damage control. i always go with what comes out first. after that it’s all up in the air on how they want to spin it. just think of what comes out during news/reviews/ well anything. things always change to either lessen the damage or tone down the success. just my take.
The thing is that I haven’t heard anything yet that worries me, freaks me out, or even gets me nervous. It’s just interesting to see other people’s reactions.
Maybe it’s because my “wish list” for the next three episodes is very short. It consists of one wish: “Don’t be boring.”
So far, that’s not going to be a problem.
Normally, I don’t sort of react how I have the last couple of days as I’m generally.. more ‘clear of mind’ when it comes to this sort of stuff, as I’ve trusted them with the finales/mid-season finales before, and have no reason not to now. I suppose I just wish Fedak would handle his interviews..better? I guess? He just says some things to get a rise out of people, and sadly it works!
Still.. as anxious as I am, I’m still very excited.
Well the operative word seems to be “satisfying” so I haven’t seen anything to get too upset over. I do feel a lot of extra tension right now with this being THE END! If they screw it up its screwed up forever. I think its unlikely they would do something that upsets me, but as long as it remains a possibility I’ll be a little on edge (meaning I’ll be on edge until 1/27 at 2200!).
I do require a happy ending, but I’ve tried to keep my expectations at a minimal level. Hopefully that way I’ll be pleased with anything positive.
But while I’m anxious for the finale to get here, I’m very sad that this is it. I have invested SO MUCH time in this site these last 2 1/2 years, and so much emotional energy in the show, it will be a major life change when it all comes to a halt.
Perfect!
Dave and Peter: Ditto that!
This could be DR’s way of saying that the whole amnesia thing is only a minor plot point and that people are spinning big stories off of something that isn’t that important to the story. Sort of like the old story of five blind people each touching a piece of an elephant and then trying to describe what the animal looks like based on the part that they hold. Amnesia could be the elephant’s tail, not very useful in getting an idea of what an elephant looks like.
We need to start a poll!
Will “the Last S5 spoiler page you’ll ever need” – actually hold up until the end of the season?
Wow – I’m away for a couple days – and when I come back – BOOM – there seems to be a contagious strain of high anxiety infecting many within the Chuck fandom….
Friday Nights haven’t been this stressful since I recall hoping to find a date for the school dance 🙂
I just hope that some of our fine folks don’t end up with an aneurysm…. yeeeks – there’s waaaay too much thinking goin’ on – and think’n ain’t what this Tigger does best ~ just say’n.
All I can say – I can’t remember the last time there was sooo much anticipation and speculation about 3 episodes of Chuck!!!! Wow – my hats off to TPTB. They’ve got us hooked, now, just waiting to be reeled in – ha!
This page is pushing the limits of what my iPad can handle now, I’m concerned because tomorrow its all I’ll have most of the day. Well, if I fall silent most of the day tomorrow you’ll know its because the iPad is overwhelmed!
Maybe we need a “the last last S5 spoiler page”
atcDave I want to thank you for letting the crazies like me vent and speculate. I discover this blog way too late, however the people here including yourself have been nothing but respectful. People like you are what make the Chuck fans the greatest fans of all.
Esardi it is awesome when guests say that! You know when we first formed this blog we made it our goal to avoid censorship but keep things civil. Things do get heated sometimes, but I think we’ve made a place for a good cross-section of fans.
We may come close to setting a record if things keep up like this until the finale! I think its fun for all of us when fans get excited about the show we love.
atcDave I have a strong suspicion that you guys are going to set all kinds of records when it comes to posting especially after this Friday’s episode.
Especially since we’ll likely see the giant promo after the episode. This place likely explode.
Yes it is getting difficult to see posts and is only going to get worse. What about “The last Chuck Spoiler Page You’ll Ever Need (sob, sob)”, or something? That way it wouldn’t negate the name of the current page.
I’ll try to put up another spec page later, but last one didn’t really take.
How about an homage to the Beatles?
And in the end,
(the love you take is equal to the love you make.)
Ok, maybe a little cheesy, but …..